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Park Board Minutes 2005 09-12-05 UNITED CITY OF YORKVILLE YORKVILLE PARKS & RECREATION DEPARTMENT BOARD MEETING Parks & Recreation Administrative offices Riverfront Building Monday, September 12, 2005 MINUTES CALL TO ORDER. Meeting was called to order by Chris Rollins at 7 :00 p.m. ROLL CALL : Chris Rollins, Ken Koch, Van Truman, Tammy Smock, and Richard Korinek GUESTS/CITY OFFICIALS/STAFF: Laura Brown, Park and Recreation Director ! Sue Swithin, Superintendent of Recreation John Wyeth, City Attorney Dean E. Wolfer, Alderman j Wanda Ohare, Alderwoman Joe Besco, Alderman PUBLIC COMMENTS : None APPROVAL OF MINUTES : Minutes from the August 8, 2005 board meeting and the August 22, 2005 joint meeting with Public Works were approved on motion by Van Truman and seconded by Richard Korinek. The motion was unanimously approved. BILLS REVIEW. Cash Analysis & Bills List There was an addition to the bills list. Jack' s Floor Care' s original check was $75 . 00 short so a check was cut to rectify the situation. Richard Korinek motioned to approve the bills list and was seconded by Ken Koch. Roll call vote: Chris Rollins—Yes, Ken Koch—Yes, Van Truman—Yes, Richard Korinek—Yes, Tammy Smock—Yes. The motion was unanimously approved. OLD BUSINESS . Update on Establishing a Park District Request from Alderman Munns (This item was discussed first on the agenda as John Wyeth, City Attorney, had to leave early) John Wyeth came to give the Park Board information on the formation of a park district. From his experience he indicated that there are stages to follow that work to form a park district. The first stage is to have a threshold question which is, "Should we take the time and effort to consider placing the question upon the ballot?" not "Will a park district be a better source of the delivery of park and recreation facilities and service?" The issue should be to find out if there is public support for the investigation. There is no reason to do it if there is no interest or public support. 1 i The second stage is informing the public using a hypothetical park district. You will then be able to get the public' s ideas and input. You will discuss the territory. The territory could be the current city boundaries or the school district boundaries or county-wide boundaries excluding territories that are already a park district. If the city boundaries are used, newly annexed territories could be annexed into the park district, which is not so with a school boundary. I Park districts are more capable to deliver park and recreation services and facilities than are municipalities because they are focused and they have a tax stream that is not used for any other reason. Communities with park districts seem to have more in the way of facilities and programs than communities with park departments . Over time the total tax paid by residents will be more with a park district and municipality as opposed to just a park department and a municipality. You would then need to inform the public that if tl-iey want this, it is going to cost them. It will be a continuation of the services that they already have. So when the people vote it has been presented in a way where all they need to decide is do they want the added services or not. It needs to be portrayed to the public before you go forward that there will be growing pains . There will be a certain amount of adjustment. With a brand new park district there will be five commissioners who will levy next year' s taxes. There will be 8 – 18 months period where there would be no revenue. So the situation can range from the municipality not helping at all, leaving the new park district to be totally on their own until the taxes come in and see what they can develop to the municipality transferring all of their facilities, equipment and employees over to the new park district and gap funding until that next year. It will probably be somewhere in between where, for example, they may not know who is supposed to be cutting the grass, etc. But, if the end result is worth while, the people will vote yes . The next step is to get the word out—pamphlets, forums, radio, television, etc. The information needs to be accurate. You can inform them what their taxes would be, what the budget is, and how it compares to the current situation. The territory will be determined. If stages one and two were properly implemented, there should be a bit of a movement rather than a push away from the idea. It there is a push away from the idea, you may want to drop the idea altogether. The referendum will elect five commissioners who will decide what to do . They will handle the situations as mentioned with the growing pains—starting with no money until the taxes are received and negotiating with the City. The City will then have another unit of government with their own elected officials and budget. There . is no cross reporting requirements so they do not need to add more parks because the City says they want more parks. A park district is limited by land use laws and life safety laws. They will need to get permits to build buildings and abide by the health rules/sprinkler systems. After John Wyeth supplied the Board with the information Chris Rollins had a question. He stated that the average person does not have an opinion about this topic in a 2 II I community like ours . He questioned how to have a threshold question without informing the people why it is important for them to ask themselves this question. He felt it might be important on how they asked the threshold question. They may want to ask the question in a way such as "There are two options to run parks. One would be to continue to do it the way we do or the other would be to have a park district. " There is so much lack of knowledge about how this function is currently managed. Many people assume that there is a park district here already. That is why Chris Rollins feels that there needs to be some baseline level of knowledge about the existence of these options and some knowledge of what those things might mean to someone when you ask the question if they care whether there is a park district or a city department to run parks. Growth seems to put the most pressure on the question. Because the Park Board can envision from the standpoint of having done a five year planning exercise and knowing what to anticipate growth to be and the acreage of land to care for, they can envision this to be the biggest department of city government. Given that scenario, the Board looks at the amount of resource it receives now and in many ways it is barely adequate. This is what drives that question. They know through surveys what people want to be doing here recreationally, yet they do not have the resources to do them. If people have an awareness of that fundamental that the resources need to be split up among all other City departments, they will understand the need to ask the threshold question. Although they are aware that there is no correct answer and that many communities run wonderfully by a parks department, Yorkville is special because we are finding ourselves in an unprecedented growth mode which gives a different perspective from other communities . He feels that we need to get the public informed about what their current circumstances are and what the current circumstances are likely to be if we continue in our current structure versus as a park district. John Wyeth informed that it is important that people do not look upon this as it being pushed upon them or forced on them. Chris Rollins said if there were unlimited resources, there wouldn't be a need for a question; but since there are not, it is really a question that we have to ask since it makes a big difference on how resources are likely to be governed. It would make more sense to the people then if they know they have choices . Richard Korinek questioned about starting off with no money and what would happen to the land cash. John Wyeth informed him that the land cash fund is owned by the City along with the trucks, lawnmowers, etc. A decision would need to be made by City Council on how that would be handled. The ability to extract land cash is solely municipal authority. The City can collect it on behalf of the park district though. Currently, the City gives the park department 100% of the land cash, but the City does not need to do this . If it is all community benefit, it would not be unreasonable for the City to continue to collect land cash and grant that to a district. The City of Aurora has a parks and recreation department and the Fox Valley Park District that encompasses the city of Aurora. The formation of a park district does not mean the dissolving of a park and recreation department. So you need to know what you are exploring—the dissolving of a park and recreation department in exchange for a park district or in addition to a park district. If the City planned to have a parallel department 3 to the park district the Board would probably not get very far on getting the question on the ballot. John Wyeth informed that there are no limits on how large you can size a park district, but you must remember that the territory of the park district is the territory of who votes for this park district. But if you go too far there is the likelihood that a town would disconnect from the park district because it would not make sense to them. However, having a Yorkville/Plano park district would make sense. But you must keep in mind that some people of Yorkville may not want to be in a park district with Plano which would make them vote no against the park district. When soliciting this to the citizens, it is best not to have the government driving the issue because people tend to say no when a government is pushing higher taxes. It needs to be by the people. So if you go through the first two stages, people should come forward to encourage this. Because Yorkville tends to be a fiscally conservative minded community, residents may not see the need for a park district since they already have free maintained parks and good programs and services . Van Truman asked if there could be a backlash if we put this on the ballot now and it fails and then put it on the ballot again when it is really needed. He was wondering if the people will just think, here we' go again and hold a grudge. John Wyeth indicated that, yes, if people feel they. are being pushed, this could happen. It was mentioned that if we do not have the full Council supporting the move and the transfer of things over, it cannot be done. So it was suggested that we sit with the Board, staff, and City Council to discuss it and come upon an agreement before we go to the public. Chris Rollins indicated that to put things in perspective, many people are going elsewhere to get the activities that we do not currently provide. When you add up the amount of money they pay as out of district fees, etc. it may come to the same amount as an increase in taxes without having to travel for the activities . Wanda Ohare indicated that she personally would support whatever the Park Board decides as long as the Board was in total agreement with what the best thing would be. She believes that the asset issue could be worked out because no one wants to take away the things the people are currently enjoying. In the same respect, Tammy Smock indicated that they would also like to know what type of support they would get from City Council because if City Council is mostly against having a park district, it really wouldn't make much sense to proceed any further. And Chris Rollins indicated that it is difficult to come to complete agreement without knowing what resources the City Council would give. But Joe Besco indicated that he alone could not say whether he was for or against a park district without having more j information about it. 1 4 I Sue Swithin mentioned that possibly City Council may actually see having a park district as a relief as it would be one less issue that they would need to handle in their busy responsibilities with other departments . Although we are in pretty good shape regarding the parks standpoint due to the land cash availability, the programming portion is currently turning people away because we do not have the facilities. Laura Brown stated that there needs to be a consensus in order for this to work. She is willing to bring in people from other park districts to discuss this with them. She can ask other park departments why they didn' t become a park district. Chris Rollins, however, indicated that although the stories of these park districts/park departments my have value, they are not Yorkville and it will not answer the question, "Why do it here?" Chris feels that there would be no struggle to become a park district if we were guaranteed that everything from the park department would get transferred over to the park district. He feels that the struggle is not knowing what resources will 'be available to them. He feels that a park district is a good idea because they will devote their sole purpose on parks and recreation, whereas, the City must split this time over a number of other departments. No matter how much research a park department does on a topic and how confident they are about this topic, the best plans can easily be dropped if the City Council does not see the same point of view. Dean Wolfer indicated that because they do not know enough about a park district, it is very difficult to make any type of decision regarding it. He feels it is best if the Park Board does some more research and educates them first. If the people are going to be paying more, he wants to know why a park district is going to be better. Wanda Ohare feels that if the Park Board gets the citizens behind them on a park district, it would be very difficult for City Council to say no to it. She feels you need to find out what the citizens want because they are the ones who are paying for it. Joe Besco does not know how we would be able to separate the shared facilities and equipment at this point. Sue Swithin indicated that each department does have their own equipment except for a few of the larger specialty items. So we would just need to work on an intergovernmental agreement to share these items. I Van Truman suggested soliciting people who participate in programs to answer that threshold question. Laura said that we could do a cross selection of people--parents from preschoolers, youths with sports and non-sports, adult interests, and seniors—and do a quick survey asking if they are happy with the services and would they like the services to be increased, and if so, how? Chris Rollins, however, felt that a focus group may be a better way to go since surveys usually need follow up questions and an in-dept conversation before people can really give the full thought process. He felt it may be better to get everyone in a room so people can hear what other people have to say and listen to what the spectrum of the opinion is. They may be more valuable than a survey. The question that will be asked at this focus group is, "Do you want more services and amenities?" and then have a question and answer time. If you ask this question, everything else will come out. We will need to supply what we do, how we do it, where 5 i i the funds come from how it is structured, the budget, the five year plan, the growth, what we have been able to do with grants, and what we are up against regarding resources at hand. Tammy Smock indicated that we should add on to the question of--do you want more services? She feels we need to add, " . . . Are you willing to pay for more services?" Of course people want more services, so it would look like this is a loaded question and right behind it is a tax increase. Chris Rollins feels that when people take into consideration what they are paying in services outside of our services and the cost of gas to get to them, that this may not be that big of an issue. He feels people need to tell their story so that they can rationalize it and see that they are already paying more. Sue Swithin suggested to have classification of users—A) People who use outside services, B) People who are senior citizens, C) Adults, D) etc. By classifying the users and making sure you hit the questions for all classifications . You will probably find that one category dominates, which is probably where we will need to direct the effort. And have these people go out to talk to people. At the town meeting, we will ask—What do we want to start? What do we want to stop? And what do we want to continue? Laura Brown will draft an outline and flier and will e-mail it to the Board before it goes out to get their input. It will just be an open forum. i Castle Bank Space Status Update (This item was discussed next on the agenda as requested by the City Council attendees) Laura Brown just wanted to inform the Board that they are still working on the contract with the developer for Castle Bank and that the Senior Services Association agreement is on the City Council agenda for the September 13 , 2005 meeting. The Salvation Army for many years had received a federal contract to provide the meals on wheels in the in-house dining nutrition program. This year, however, they were not awarded that contract for Kendall County—only for McHenry and Kane. The new group, CNN (Community Nutrition Network), was awarded this three year federal contract. Salvation Army has indicated that they still desire to renew their contract with the City to stay in the Beecher Building and operate a private program at their own cost. CNN has sent a letter to the Mayor desiring an agreement to also operate in the Beecher Building to provide the meals on wheels and deli program. The Senior Service Association of Kendall County was the original group that wanted to come into the Beecher Building to provide services. The only program, however, that the Senior Services Association can refer people to is whoever has the contract for the meals on wheels . A citizen has, however, signed up for their meals from the Salvation Army. The Golden Dinners contract expire on September 30, 2005 . John Wyeth currently has all three contracts . Currently, there are approximately 600-700 people with the parks department going through the Beecher Building a year. If the Senior Services Association is awarded the Beecher Building, there is the possibility that the Parks and Recreation Department will not have any place to go due to the fact that things have not become finalized with Castle Bank yet. The Parks and Recreation Department is being moved, which is costing us 6 i money, for someone who is getting a paid contract from the county. In the past, they had to pay for their space, but now the City will be responsible to be the provider of space for their program. They will only be paying a maintenance fee which is half of the utilities, half of the janitorial fees, half of the maintenance supplies, and a $ 10, 000 capital improvement fee. i Some of the additional expenses that will be incurred with the parks and recreation department being moved to Castle Bank would be the utilities which we currently do not pay Com Ed with our municipal contract, and maintenance fees because at Castle Bank we will need to maintain our own area. Along with these fees, we will still need to pay for space at Parkview and Cross Lutheran. Although there may be more space at Castle Bank it does not change the fact that the Beecher Center is more centrally located, with a park for the kids to play on while a j sibling is in a program and a library nearby for the older children. The Junior Women' s League will also no longer have a place to do their Easter egg hunt because they cannot do it in a parking lot. They were willing to fix Castle Bank up to the Seniors ' specifications with an elevator, a kitchen, offices, etc. The only reason why the Senior Services Association does not want to use Castle Bank is because they will be in a basement. Senior Services was also offered City Hall which is newly remodeled, but, again, they did no want it because it was a basement. Programs cannot be put in the winter catalog if we do not know where we can hold them basically, those would include the programs held in the Perkins room, such as karate. There has been much growth in the karate program. If the program needs to temporarily be stopped, people are most likely going to be established elsewhere and find it easier not to switch back to the Yorkville program. The contract with Senior Services would be five years . If you add five years to a child who is eight years old, this makes a huge difference. If CNN does not get the room in Yorkville, they will work out of their Morris location. It is not exactly known where the Senior Services Association would go if the Beecher Building did not work out but they must have had some type of a back up plan. It was stated that Betty of Senior Services had other offers, but she was under the assumption that the Beecher Building was a done deal. Chris Rollins stated that if Beecher Building is supposed to be a community center, it should occupy mostly the community of Yorkville. It seems that Senior Services makes a county statement more than a city statement. The original charter why the Beecher Building was built was for use of all of the citizens of the community. The Board wanted to make it very clear that they are not against the seniors. They just do not feel that moving them to the Beecher Building is the best decision. They want to give them the space they-need. They do not want to make the seniors go without the services . They want to figure out how Senior Services can provide the services and where else it can be done. I i 7 i i Chris Rollins does not feel that the City looked at all that was being done in the Beecher Center or considered all the costs involved to move parks and recreation out of the building. He would like them to look at the impact of the change and the sacrifices. He feels that the 600-700 people who currently use the building are going to turn to the Board and ask them how they let this happen. It was stated that the Mayor feels that Parks and Recreation is receiving more space at Castle Bank but he is failing to look at the cost or the timing. It is also being overlooked that when Parks and Recreation moves to Castle Bank, there will be alcohol-serving restaurants on the floor above them. I The senior segment of the population must be represented. They have put their time in the community. It was countered that though this is true, the seniors have been able to use these services their entire life and that though they have paid their taxes, the level of taxation was much lower so proportionately the younger people who live here who have paid their taxes have paid a far greater share than many seniors have. The seniors have a j tax cap working in their favor. The main issue is that we cannot provide continuous service to people. It is not the issue of space. From the Board' s perspective more space does not justify the loss of programs available to the people. SR,4 Reimbursement Request/Policy Draft Laura Brown drafted a policy. The policy will include a maximum of two programs, similar to what we do with our scholarship program, and will pay only the non-resident portion of the fee. All program fees must be paid by the resident. Excluded from this program will include travel/vacation typed trips . Van Truman made a motion to accept the policy for the SRA reimbursement as drafted and Ken Koch seconded the motion. Roll call vote: Chris Rollins—Yes, Ken Koch—Yes, Van Truman Yes, Richard Korinek—Yes, Tammy Smock—Yes. The motion was unanimously approved. Laura Brown will be submitting the request for Camp Wabaunsee Chiefs that came in over the summer. Update on Parks /PW Maintenance Facility There were no new updates on this at this time. NEW BUSINESS : Scope of Services for Design Fees — Park D Laura Brown indicated that they were going to go out for bid. She does not feel we should have to fight over a bill every time but Mike Schoppe indicated that Laura was right and that he will work with her. The estimated budget on this is $ 300,000, however, our share is only $ 150,000 because there is some inherent costs the developer needs to pay. Mike Schoppe' s design fee is a percentage of total costs . His fee ranges from 6%- 9%. Laura Brown wanted the Board to make sure they were aware of the situation. Laura Brown will ask Mike Schoppe to pull out on the grating or general park development or anything that is specifically tied to the developer that would lower Mike' s cost before he designs it. This is the site that is adjacent to the school . Motion 8 i was made by Tammy Smock and seconded by Van Truman. The motion was agreed upon with opposition made by Richard Korinek. Longford Lakes Request Longford Lakes is the property by Jewel adjacent to Walnut. There is 1 .34 acres owned by the homeowners association. Back in 2002, we received no park land, cash only. We receive $ 84, 816 for the 52 townhouse development. The president of the homeowners association indicated that they would like the City to have and maintain this land. The City would like to know if Parks and Recreation would want it. There is a lot of multi- unit housing; it is behind commercial; and it is traffic land lot. Kids would have to cross traffic to get to this park. This is not the best position for a park. The suggestions made were to make this a tennis court, a garden lot, or a small park. A vote was taken whether we should take this land: Chris Rollins—No, Ken Koch—No, Van Truman No, Richard Korinek—Yes, Tammy Smock—No . The Board will not take this land. Park Priam * Mg Applications /Piequests The park naming applications will be forwarded to the next meeting. Park Board Meeting Dates (Fiala) Since Heather Fiala was not present, the Park Board meeting dates will be forwarded to the next meeting. City Council – Request of Land Cash Funds As printed in the newspaper, there was a request of land cash funds . Laura Brown does not have any direction on this at this time. REPORTS Recreation Report Quarterly Report – Every quarter Sue Swithin adds up the numbers to see where we are at. Everything is going up . They have added additional staff. Preschool, especially the two-year old program, has gotten huge. Depending on the season there is a 60/40 or 70/30 resident/non-resident participation. We are creating a new preschool program, j including a two-year old with mom program to introduce the children to the preschool program. Promenade of the Arts – A summary of this event was included in the packet. ' I ADDITIONAL BUSINESS None C i CORRESPONDENCE : Miscellaneous Correspondence Regarding the article titled Yorkville Might Tap Developer Cash for Center for Seniors, Chris Rollins stated that he agrees with Alderwoman Spears that senior development should pay a senior impact fee that is proportional. If there is an impact fee on senior housing, then it should be in proportion to the number of seniors in our population rather 9 i than taking general land cash and tack that into a senior center. A planning process should take place. i City Council was saying that they want more control of land cash, but they already determine the proportion of land cash. How we receive land cash is sometimes not clear cut because it is tied to the building permit, etc. We do, however, try to get half if not all up front. We have million of dollars in our account, but it is all accounted for parks that need to be built. If we do not keep the land cash, we will not be able to build the parks that we promised to build. This would cause lawsuits against us . Inflation needs to be taken into account too because some of our parks are approximately eight years away. We will be lucky to be able to do what is scheduled as it is . We do not have the ability to collect any additional money. It cannot be done if we don' t plan, schedule, or budget for it. At the City meeting Laura Brown had asked if we are diverting land cash or are we forming a park district because they are somewhat connected. Alderman Marty Munns had indicated that they better use up the land cash on the senior center then before we go park district, The Park Board had recommended no park land in Autumn Ridge and all cash so that we can build a regional park. The City Council had overturned that. They decided that they did not want a regional park, but instead a neighborhood park. So City Council accepted a 212 acre center park and the balance in land cash. We, therefore, lost approximately three acres of money and now have to create a park where we did not need one. Gilbert Park is done. Sunflower Park is under construction and the concrete is all in. And Cannonball Park should be started next week. ADJOURNMENT . The meeting adjourned at 10 : 05 p.m. following the motion by Ken Koch and seconded by Tammy Smock. The motion was unanimously approved. Respectfully Submitted, Jeanne Arbet Minute Taker I t i 10 I I ATTENDANCE Yorkville Parks & Recreation Department Board Meeting Monday, September 12, 2005 i i Please Simon In GUESTS/CITY OFFICIALS/STAFF: Laura Brown, Parks and Recreation Director { Sue Swithin, Superintendent of Recreation I John Wyeth, City Attorney Dean E. Wolfer, Alderman Wanda Ohare, Alderwoman Joe Besco, Alderman 'i i I I BOARD MEMBERS : �I ❑ Heather Fiala ❑ Alderman Paul James Ken Koch Richard Korinek � Chris Rollins � Tammy Smock j Van Truman I i