Public Works Minutes 2004 11-22-04 i
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APPROVED WITH CORRECTIONS
1 /24/05
UNITED CITY OF YORKVILLE
PUBLIC WORKS COMMITTEE MEETING
Monday, November 22, 2004
7: 00 PM
City Hall Conference Room
City Committee and Staff in Attendance:
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Chairman Alderman Besco
Alderwoman Burd
Public Works Director Eric Dhuse
Alderman Sticka
City Engineer Joe Wywrot
Guests.
Jeff Freeman (E.E.I.)
Denise Clementz (Resident of Oswego)
Chuck & Cindy Nelson (Resident of Yorkville)
Joe & Kathy Miranda (Resident of Oswego)
Gerald & Lois Seaton (Resident of Yorkville)
Jack & Sharon Keck (Resident of Yorkville)
The meeting was called to order at 7 :00 pm by Chairman Alderman Besco .
Approval/Corrections of Minutes : October 25, 2004 * The Committee present
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unanimously approved the minutes at hand to move them forward.
New Business:
8. Water Quality Issues for Residents on or Near Bristol Ridge Road Private
Wells : Alderman Besco stated that he put this item on the agenda after meeting
and talking with many residents at the Bristol Township Meeting and had heard
that their water quality since the deep well was drilled in Grande Ridge has
dramatically declined. Mr. Besco felt that this needed to be brought to the
attention of the Council and had spoken with Joe Wywrot earlier in the day on the
matter as well.
Mr. Joe Wywrot confirmed that Alderman Besco and he had discussed the issue
and also stated that 1 or more of the residents present this evening over the course
of the last year. He stated that most of the calls he received were when the well
near Bristol Ridge and Kennedy Road were being drilled. He stated that prior to
the deep well being drilled they needed to drill a shallow well first. They need
water to drill a deep well, so what happens is you drill a shallow well to produce
the water needed for the drilling of the deep well. What they did find out in this
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project is 04
was not enough water in the approximately 90ft shallow well
they had drilled to get the water, so they ended up trucking water on site to use for
the drilling of the deep well. The shallow well has since been abandoned and the
deep well is complete and in service now. It has filled the water tower in Grande
Reserve and most of the water mains in Grande Reserve are full as well.
He stated this issue was brought before Public Works Committee during the
summer and at that time the City asked E.E.I. to take a look at that and give their
opinion as to why this may be occurring. They said that it is possible that during
the drilling of a shallow well to change the flow path of the water down in the
aquifer and could affect the water picking up minerals that have been sitting and
drawn into existing wells in the area. He stated that as the water settles down to
normal over time the existing wells should go back to the previous flow pattern.
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Mr. Wywrot stated he had spoken to one resident in that area and she stated that j
the water quality from her well had improved but that all of a sudden the water
quality had gone down again. During the period of time that went between
talking to her the City or Developers had not been doing any work to cause a
disturbance in the way the water flows in the shallow aquifer that he was aware
of. He suggested to her then to continue the well use and over time it should go
back to the original water quality. He stated he has not heard from that resident in
2-3 months time, so he is assuming that the quality is better. He stated to the
residents present that he really does not have any suggestions for them and he can
only offer the information of what the City' s Consultants have given them, stated
above. He stated lastly that it takes time, maybe longer for some wells than
others, to get back to the normal operation.
Alderman Sticka asked the residents present what is actually wrong with the
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water.
Kathy Miranda from the Lynwood Subdivision stated in their case they have a
filter after the water goes through the water softener and are now changing every
2 weeks now where they use to change it every 3 -4 months. She stated it is from
rust and black sediment that flows through it.
Alderman Besco asked if anyone had noticed the change of the water quality
improving like Mr. Wywrot stated it should be doing.
Kathy Miranda stated that theirs has not gotten better at all and has actually ruined
her bathroom fixtures in their home.
Mr. Wywrot stated that them being located in Lynwood and the well that was
drilled was nearly 3/4 mile away should have little to no impact on the homes wells
in located. Kathy Miranda stated that the problems did not exist until the drilling
had occurred. Mr. Wywrot stated that he believed them, but he could not imagine
that such a small well so far away would impact them.
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Alderwoman Burd at this time questioned if this could be an impact from any
other development in their area besides what Yorkville is involved in, like the
construction out on the corner of Route 34 and Orchard Road.
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Mr. Wywrot replied that he was not sure what they were doing there and is
probably all village water there so he could not see that being what is affecting
them. He stated that he believes King Nursery does have a shallow well that
supplements there pond, but that well has been there for awhile. He stated that it
is used sporadically or only when it is needed.
Alderwoman Burd asked if rust had more to do with the piping. Mr. Wywrot
stated that there is iron in the water, the minerals precipitate out and sit in the
bottom of the main. Now here there are no mains, the water mains would actually
be the aquifer or the bedrock, so the rust will precipitate out and sit in the crevices
of the rocks. Alderman Sticka stepped into to state to the Committee to remember
when the City was considering using shallow wells for a project, it was suggested
then that they would have to put in iron removal because of the iron present in the
water which would be an added cost. Mr. Wywrot stated that Alderwoman Burd
is using City water and the iron is present in her area do to the age of the water
mains there and they have to be flushed twice a year to try and keep the rust out
for the residents. Alderman Sticka pointed out that in the newer parts of town rust
is not an issue for residents.
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Denise Clementz from Lyncliff Drive approached the Committee to speak next.
She stated that last year during the winter for many months where the ponds are
located the development of Grande Reserve had water pumped into the Ditch area
at a constant almost. She stated that would affect the wells in the area. Mr.
Wywrot stated that they were doing the dewatering there and that might effect the
wells for a short time.
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Denise Clementz then asked what happens with Grande Reserve ' s ponds and
where is the water coming from. Mr. Wywrot replied that it is coming from
ground water. She then questioned if that would take away from their
groundwater supply as well. Alderman Sticka questioned if the ponds were lined.
Mr. Wywrot stated that they would have to be to hold the water properly but he j
wasn't for sure. They would be lined with soil or clay to hold the water in. j
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Alderman Besco questioned the residents if any of them had there water tested.
Chuck Nelson from Parkway Drive stated that he just had his done last week and
it came back clean from bacteria. There water does have a bad taste and odor
which it never had before.
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Sharon Keck from Parkway Drive stated that they never had this problem before .
They now are dealing with sooty oil which appears all black. It was mostly
upstairs.
Alderman Besco questioned if when they do the well drilling could any of the
well drilling clay possibly get into the aquifers. Mr. Wywrot stated no , that when
you do the process the material is removed. He stated that there is a steel casing
pipe that extends from the surface of the ground down 900ft approximately to seal
the well off from the aquifer so that there is no interaction between the two
aquifers.
Jack Keck stated that what his wife mentioned was sulfur based he believed. He
also questioned the dewatering process that they had going all winter and they ran
a 6inch pipe constantly and now he sees that there is a dewatering process going
on over on Mill Street. Mr. Wywrot stated that Fox Metro is doing that
dewatering process. Mr. Keck asked if that will affect their water flow as well.
Mr. Wywrot stated they are lowering the water table in the immediate area to put
in sanitary sewer piping. He stated that dewatering wells can affect nearby
residential wells. When constructing a utility pipe there are different levels piping
go into the ground. Water piping are usually set 5-6 ft into the ground, and
sanitary piping go down to 25-35 ft into the ground and this is where you need to
go into dewatering to be able to get into the ground to set the piping. In the
Grande Reserve area the ground water elevation is at 15-20 foot which makes it
not possible to put sewer in there without dewatering. He stated that the
residential wells are usually at about 40 feet. Alderman Besco stated that the
dewatering is complete in Grande Reserve. Mr. Keck replied that they are still
doing dewatering in other developments around them too now. Mr. Wywrot
stated that this is moving away from their area so it will have less and less impact
on these residents.
Denise Clementz asked what was to explain the water problem now then. She
then asked what is going to happen in the future then. She discussed how in
Oswego about 1 - 1 & 1 /2 years ago they had a problem with 8 houses had their
wells go dry. Mr. Wywrot responded he was not sure what the resident' s water
problem is now and he stated that in Yorkville about 10+ years ago in the
Cannonball area with a few wells did dry up. He added that this was during a
dewatering process going on around them and the water did eventually come
back. She went on to state that she thought maybe the developments pumping the
water in the big ponds were a reason the wells could dry up. Mr. Wywrot stated
that a water fall and fountain going in, but it is just using the same water or
circulating what they have in the pond. He explained that this will not be pulling
any water from the aquifer at all. The replenishing of the water in the pond is just
storm or run-off water.
Alderman Besco questioned that if everything goes right these residents should
see an improvement in their wells. Mr. Wywrot stated that dewatering in the area
was completed 6 months or more ago, but the dewatering going on with Fox
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Metro is ongoing and will be moving west. So as this moves away the well water
should return to normal.
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Mrs. Keck stated that the oily residue they were dealing with has disappeared but
the smell is still there.
Mr. Wywrot stated all they can do is wait and as time goes by and the dewatering
process moves away, the ground water should go back to its previous state.
Kathy Miranda added that their water pressure is not the same either. Mr.
Wywrot stated that has nothing to do with the aquifer that is from the water pump.
The filter they are changing every two weeks could be causing the problem. The
Miranda' s stated that everything is new and the Committee discussed the specifics
for a moment.
Alderman Sticka asked how it was handled when the wells went dry previously.
Mr. Dhuse stated it was waited out and this is because the wells were only 22 ft j
deep.
Mr. Miranda asked how long they have before their wells go dry with the City
having the new tower over there. Mr. Miranda stated that water is going to flow
down to the other aquifer. Mr. Wywrot explained that the aquifers are separated j
by impermeable layers which means water can not go in-between each other. j
That is why the City went down to the aquifer below those residents. Alderman
Sticka stated that there is another aquifer between what the City is pulling from
and the local residents.
The Committee asked Mr. Jeff Freeman if in his experience he had ever seen this
happening to residents' wells. He stated he has never directly dealt with it, but he
has heard some situations when construction activity like de-watering cause an
interruption, but on the short term everything goes back to normal. He also stated
from the City' s perspective they do the studies to set up correctly to make sure
they do not mess up local wells before going forward with new wells being added.
He stated that it sounds like the water levels here are rebounding and in some
cases it may take longer for the quality to get back to normal.
Alderman Besco stated that he is suggesting for the residents to keep updating the
City and will have on agenda again in 3 -4 months to monitor situation. The
residents were given cards of who they can reach for questions or comments at
this time.
The residents asked Mr. Freeman if he had found any wells that had completely
dried up from construction in the area going on. He stated in all the cases he had
heard of the water did always eventually come back to normal.
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The residents then questioned the Committee what will happen if their wells dry
up and who will be paying for it. Mr. Freeman stated that in some cases where
the residents wells had dried up for short term the residents had to live off of
bottled water, but that was for a period of 8 days too. As far as who will pay the j
Committee stated they could not reply to that question.
Mr. Keck asked if utilities would eventually be available or coming down Route
34 for them to have access to . Mr. Wywrot stated that the utilities coming down
should not cause de-watering to be needed to put these in. He also stated that Fox
Metro will be putting in Route 34 interceptor which will come down Route 34
from the east up Charles Lane to connect into Grande Reserve, but that should not
be for a couple of years. With this there may be some de-watering happening in
the process.
Mr. Wywrot stated that overall it is possible this work could cause the water to
change its flow pattern and pick up minerals that have been laying dormant for
years and is now going into the resident' s wells. Alderman Besco asked that the
residents to let the wells have more time to go back to normal, but keep in touch
with the City so they know what is going on. The Committee lastly thanked the
residents for letting the City know what is occurring with their wells.
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8. Hydrogeology and Water Quality Study for a Potential Development of a
Safe Secondary Municipal Water Supply from the Shallow Aquifer Within
the Northwest Planning Area: Jeff Freeman with E.E.I. started by addressing
his memorandum dated 11 /19/04 talks a little about where the City has been,
where they are now with their water system and where the City needs to go . He
stated on the supply and treatment side the City with the addition of these 2 new
wells will have the ability to pump 7 million gallons of water a day into their
system. All these wells are from the deep sand stone aquifers. He stated that in
the original plan for the City with project plan, radium compliance, etc. ; they did
look at shallow ground water wells as an option for radium compliance plus
having an additional source of water for the City as a way for diversifying their
sources.
He went on to say that along with the sand and shallow well review they also did
an environmental database search. In the search a few things came up. One of
the items that came up was the Nelson Landfill site near Yorkville which as of
now is abandoned and has been for 30 years or so . It is located at the bottom of
East Beecher Road. Based on historical review of the information, it was a nice
little sand and gravel deposit, which is good from a portable water perspective.
They mined the sand and gravel for aggregate review and at that point they
decided to fill it with garbage. The construction of that facility at that time was
made unknown to as what the techniques used were and the proper techniques
were more than unlikely used. Overall they have an abandoned landfill which
appears it may be connected to the sand and gravel deposits up in the northern
portion of the City where someday the City could use as a water supply. The
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question is is it connected and is there something coming out of the landfill that
would inhibit the use of the sand and gravel deposits". Ever since 2000 or so
when they had identified it the City Staff has continued to look for the ability to
look closer into the Nelson Landfill situation with potential for gaining additional
funding.
The USGS proposal before the Committee here will meet a lot of these objectives.
Since the USGS is a Federal Agency, essentially they can do a lot of the Scientific
Review of the Landfill. They can do the hydrogeology to determine what the
ground water looks like as far as the flow and they can also do some water quality
testing to determine through monitoring wells on the outside of the landfill to see
if there is are things going into the wells to show migration from the landfill to
operations. After they have that information they will need to take it to other j
levels to determine what it means from a contamination perspective either on the
local shallow ground water level or possibly even having some surface water
influences from that area. C.E.C.I . has been recommended to be part of this
process and have a proposal inside the packet for the City and would stand as the
City' s hazardous waste Brownfields Consultant. They can work with Bob Kay
with the USEPA who is putting out $50,000. 00 from their Brownfields program
to characterize this property and look at it to determine where the City is at. Once
the USGS identifies the baseline information a decision will have to be made at
that point to determine if it is a problem from a hazardous waste situation. If not,
great the City can move on from there. If it is, how is the City going to take care
of the problem. One of the options of taking care of it is to do a Brownfields
program and clean up the site, redevelop for a use from there.
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Secondarily, the City has the Brownfields considerations, and then the City has
the portable water considerations which his firm has continued to work with them
on that front. Through the evaluation of that information from USGS and C.E. C.
they can determine if it is smart for the City to continue progressing toward a
shallow sand and gravel well up in that area. Mr. Freeman explained that the sand
and gravel is not every where, you have to find the right locations. Generally to
the North and Northwest are the best locations throughout the Community.
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As part of the original contract they will do some field work to do geophysical
exploration to locate sand and gravel and then progress into well logs and
eventually a test well to determine if it makes sense to go forward. They have
been holding up on moving forward on this to wait to see what was going on with
the Nelson Landfill first. He stated that there is also a lot of development
proposed in that North-Northwest area and they need to identify there well sites
now before the homes are built.
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Mr. Freeman is recommending that the City move forward and C.E. C.I. has
submitted their proposal which E.E.I. looked over. Mr. Freeman, Mr. Wywrot
and Tony Graff met with USGS last week to go through their proposal and talk in
more detail and discussed the roles in the process. He stated that E.E.I . ' s fee
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amount is in the memorandum and is more of a monitoring fee. They are
suggesting to amend there contract that they had in 2003 for this work to show
added costs.
Alderman Besco stated that the monitoring wells are all in place now but have not
been checked for awhile. Mr. Freeman stated that USGS will look at these
monitoring wells can be used for the study, but they will have the ability to put in
more if needed.
Mr. Freeman stated from a funding perspective in general summary, they have
suggested over a 2 fiscal years (05 -06) the USEPA is willing to pitch in
$50,000. 00 from the Brownfields, the USGS will put in $40,000. 00 and the
remainder will have to come from the City at this time. The total amount then
would come to $ 162,000 . 00 with 55% from grant money. The remainder of
$72,000. 00 the City would need to commit to putting in over the 2 fiscal years.
Alderman Sticka stated that when all of this work is finished and all the money is
spent, the City is left with just knowledge. This leaves the cost of the
construction afterward. Mr. Freeman stated that the City will be closer to having
access to having the ability of sand and gravel wells which the City will need in
the next 5 to 10 years. Alderman Sticka asked if it is possible after all the work
here is done in doing the study and the money is gone, that the answer will be `no
you should not put in wells over there. ' Mr. Freeman stated that is possible, but is
very valuable information for Yorkville as far as the water supply perspective.
Mr. Wywrot stated it will be less expensive than putting in the well and then find
out the City could not use it.
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Alderwoman Burd questioned if the City gets the okay to put the well in and then
the landfill shift and then make the well not okay. Mr. Freeman stated that the
landfill has been abandoned long enough that it should not be shifting anymore
and everything is stabilized. Alderwoman Burd asked if this will be a 100%
guarantee as far as information as to this being a safe water supply. Mr. Freeman
stated that there good probability that the water supply is safe. Mr. Muse stated
that in the report it states that even the farmers around the Landfill had no
contamination what so ever, which is a very positive thing.
The Committee discussed that the City will be putting in their shallow wells a
little bit deeper than the residence in the area and they will be laid out
systematically as well. With the shallow wells the radium is almost non-existent.
The hardness is higher and the resolution for that will be to use an ion exchange
and the City will have to do iron removal as well. The shallow wells can be sent
to tower 6 for the treatment.
The Committee discussed if they could use C.E.C. without having an open bid.
The Committee decided since the City is already working with the company and
this being a specialty issue it is okay to stay with the company.
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The Committee discussed how Brownfields is made for helping in clean up if the
Nelson Landfill is found to have contamination.
Alderman Besco stated that Tony Graff informed him that this project did have
funding. The Committee agreed that this would be a legitimate cost to put
towards the City' s water supply. They also discussed that the deep aquifer cold
keep supplying the community and there may be no need for the shallow wells for
a long time to come. Mr. Freeman stated that Kane County is doing a $ 1 .2
million study to look at the deep aquifer system and E.E.I . is following that study
for all the surrounding Municipalities use. He went on to state that in the late
` 80 ' s it had dropped significantly and then the Lake Michigan water started to be
pumped out west and it raised back up greatly.
The Committee brought up the idea of using the Fox River as well. There are
several other Communities to the North like Elgin and Aurora who do use that as
a source. The Committee agreed that this should be a last resort due to the major
regulatory issues that go along with doing this. The cost of the treatment to do
this will be a huge cost to the City of Yorkville if they have to go this route.
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The Committee decided to send this to 12/7 COW for full discussion with the
recommendation for the City to move forward with it. They will include the
USGS, C.E. C . , and E.E.I. proposals and suggestions.
2. CEC Recommendations Phase I — ESA Countryside Shopping Center: Mr.
Wywrot stated that this item was brought forward by Mr. Graff. The Committee
discussed why this was sent to Public Works. They found that this is here as FYI
for the Committee due to the contamination that was found in the area from the
drycleaners. Mr. Wywrot stated that this is being recommended to go forward
with completing the Phase I process in for the study on the drycleaner there. The
letter did not stated who is doing this, how long it will take and who will be
paying for it.
They found no action necessary to be taken at this point and will send forward to
City Council for the public hearing that is scheduled for this issue tomorrow
evening. The Committee will question this issue at the Public Hearing to find out
what this letter is exactly saying. The Committee agreed that the City should not
be paying for any of this work to be done.
3. Watershed Planning Implementation Program Donation : Mr. Wywrot stated
that the Conservation Foundation is looking for the City of Yorkville to
contribute the amount of $3 ,000. 00 as they have in the past since they are in the
watershed area. The Committee agreed that this should move forward to 12/7
COW as consent agenda. They felt they get their moneys worth of information
and help.
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4. Water Reports for September and October 2004 : The Committee looked over
the reports. The Committee had no questions and these will move forward to
12/7 COW as consent agenda.
5. Well #7 Treatment Facility — Change Order #4 : Mr. Wywrot stated that this
is for 3 items with a total of $9,368 . 50 increase in cost. He recommended this
move forward. The Committee agreed to send this to 12/7 COW as consent
agenda.
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6. Request to Purchase Trucks : Eric Dhuse stated he had discussed these a few
months ago and now is bringing the specifics to the Committee . He stated that
the Sewer Dept and the Park Dept trucks are budgeted for. The proposed
Engineering Dept truck can be funded out of the reserve funds and is needed
greatly. He will create line item for the new budget. These are through the state
purchase program and will be February or March before they are received. The
Committee discussed the specifics of what the trucks will have on them. The
Committee agreed that these are needed with the growth of the City. This will
move on to 12/7 COW for discussion.
7. Well #8 — Change Order #1 : Mr. Wywrot stated that this is in the amount of
$39, 145 . 50 of a decrease leaving the final contract price at $488,802. 50. He felt
it was great of Layne Western to reduce this contract being it took them 3 tries to
drill the well and they decided to eat the cost of those extra tries. He felt this was
a good testament to using this Company. The Committee agreed to move this on
to 12/7 COW as consent agenda.
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Old Business .
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1 . Director of Public Works — Salary Survey: Mr. Dhuse gathered information
for the survey from City Tech Data and IML for the Committee to look over.
There were lots of examples provided and the Committee agreed that the position
did need to have a salary increase adjustment compared to other communities.
This will move on to 12/7 COW for discussion with the min/max range should be
increased.
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2. Utility Locator Position — PW 10/25/04: Mr. Wywrot stated that this is the first
draft of the new position for the Committee to look at. He stated that Mike
Robinson did put this together for them. They are looking to fund this position
for 511105 and this is the first step in the process to getting that done. It was
suggested to work with the schools to train and Mr. Dhuse felt it may be better to
have someone older and with a better work ethic handling this type of position.
As far as the schooling necessary, this position has more to do with previous
experience due to the knowledge necessary in doing the work. He also feels the
individual would need a good level of responsibility being that they would be
working on their own. The Committee decided to move this forward to the
Administration Committee to look over and discuss the salary range.
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3. Game Farm Road / Somonauk Street Update — PW 10/25/04 : Mr. Wywrot
stated that there is no update with this issue. It was sent back to Smith
Engineering with the recommendations from the Committee at the previous
meeting and they are moving forward with those recommendations. This was
here for FYI and was agreed to take off the agenda now until further update
needed.
4. Smith Engineering Agreement for an "As needed basis" — PW 8/23/04: Mr.
Wywrot explained that they are asking for this agreement mainly for their
accounting setup in their company. This agreement would also be used when
Engineering or Mr. Graff request small work here and there as they always have
done. He explained to the Committee that this is all for pre-approved work
(budgeted) and nothing that would have to go through Committee first anyways.
The Committee agreed that this would be good to have set up and will go on to
12/7 COW as consent agenda.
5. Sig Year Capital Improvement Program — Funding Analysis Update — COW
10/5/04 and PW 9/27/04 : Mr. Wywrot explained where this item has been and
the need that this be approved. The Committee had a group discussion regarding
where all the funds would come from. Mr. Wywrot stated he was looking for
approval to get moving on some of the projects. The Committee asked Mr.
Wywrot to send this to Tracy Pleckha . to find as much funding as possible to
start the projects necessary. This will come back in December to COW to see
what funding has been found.
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Additional Business.
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1. Hydraulic Ave- Mr. Wywrot stated that most of the water main project was paid
by the Sanitary District. The City got a free water main there, but they did not
replace the section that crosses under Route 47. The City has a unique
opportunity here with using the old sanitary sewer as a casing pipe and push a
new water main through the middle of it. The problem is that is going to cost
$ 15,000. 00, which is less than to do it another way. The other problem is the
December 10th tree lighting ceremony on that corner. The Committee agreed that
the tree lighting ceremony should be moved to Town Square Park so that the City
can move forward with getting this piping replace. Mr. Wywrot will talk to Mr.
Graff tomorrow with the okay from the Committee here tonight.
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2. In town road program, Hydraulic Ave- Mr. Wywrot stated that he has received
Smith Engineering ' s proposal to begin Phase II of the In-Town Road Program
which are the streets South of the river. The only section of Hydraulic Ave that is
included is from Adams to Morgan. Mr. Wywrot would like Hydraulic Ave to be
done from Adams to Mill in the proposal by having Smith Engineering revise
their proposal. Mr. Wywrot will talk to Mr. Graff and Smith Engineering and this
will come back to Public Works in December to look at.
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3. Water Treatment Center in Grande Reserve- Alderman Sticka stated he went
there to see the new building and recommended to the rest of the Committee to
get over there when they can to see how great it looks now that it is all finished.
He feels this is a real accomplishment by the City. There will be a ribbon cutting
ceremony eventually.
4. Mill Water Tower- Alderman Besco stated that the Mill Water Tower is now
filled and looks really sharp painted with ` Yorkville".
The meeting was adjourned at 9 :05 pm.
Minutes By: Sheila Teausaw
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