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Plan Council Minutes 1998 02-26-98 a f r UNITED CITY OF YORKVILLE Committee Minutes -Planning Council February 26, 1998 Meeting Location: City Conference Room 111 W. Fox Street Time Convened: 9:30 AM Time Adjourned: 11:20 AM Attendees: Jim Naninnga City of Yorkville Joe Wywrot City of Yorkville J.T. Johnson City of Yorkville Bob Williams R.E.I./City of Yorkville Ralph Pfister YBSD Robert E. Lee Lee Re-zoning Project Tim Fairfield BKFPD/EMS Tony Graff Police Department/City of Yorkville Chris Glick Lannert Group Mike Hitzemann BKFPD/Fire Joe Hammer Morris Engineering Mike McCurdy McCurdy Re-zoning Project Len Dreas Fox Highlands Dean Edmeier Fox Highlands ROBERT E. LEE RE-ZONING Robert E. Lee asked the function of the Planning Council. Nanninga replied that it is department heads who look at specifics(e.g. is there water, sewer, etc.), but the planner is here too. Lee stated that the property is located at 1111 S. Bridge Street, Yorkville. He also stated it is zoned for office with B-3 uses such as retail zoning. He also added that 806 warehouse has had difficulty selling and is trying to get it more marketable by seeking a B-4 zoning. Nanninga stated that B-4 zoning allows anything. Lee stated that it will allow new car dealerships, etc., but B-3 has only three uses and therefore makes it too restrictive. Nanninga's rebuttal was that B-4 has uses that we wouldn't want. Glick asked Lee if he would come to see us if he had someone with a more specific use. Lee stated that he would rather go somewhere else. Johnson asked if the Planning Council is supposed to be concerned with zoning. Nanninga replied that the minutes go to the Planning Commission, but for most of us zoning is not an issue here. Johnson stated we need to be restrictive due to the sewer. Graff discussed CarStar& the high standards that were met. Plan Council 2/26/98 -Page 2 Glick inquired about the surrounding uses. Lee stated office, new fire department, Coenly family, M-1 and recreational B-3. Glick then stated that he would rather have use before changing the zoning. If they allow B-4, the City could get something we don't want. Lee replied buy it. Nanninga stated that is why zoning is there as B-3. Lee stated that it makes it impossible to sell. Glick stated bring a use forward first before we change the zone because we won't know the impact on surrounding uses or the property itself and it may be disruptive. The purpose of zoning is to minimize uses Mike Hitzemann stated make it B-4 now for auto dealer for zoning special use. Graff stated the dilemma is we have a mixed code. Most places have auto dealership in B-3. Some of the B-4 uses, e.g. utility co yard, wouldn't be good there, but some would be okay. We should probably re-examine the B-3 code. Nanninga agreed with this. Johnson stated it was supposed to be all automotive when established. We wanted B-4 on outskirts. Lee stated he thought it should be okay for trucks. Graff stated that we have a concern and he thinks we need to market it for retail sales. Lee once again stated that B-4 gives more options. Actually, M-1 would be logical. Graff stated that looking for better solution than B-4. Zoning should not impact neighbors. Residential is moving in on neighboring properties. Glick stated that it depends on use again. If someone approached then we would say okay for special use. Lee stated that would take three years. Nanninga stated not with something favorable. Graff asked Glick to make a recommendation that the Planning Council provide the minutes to the Planning Commission. The Commission could then make a recommendation to the City Council. MCCURDY RE-ZONING McCurdy stated that his plan involves four acres that he wants to re-zone in order to build. Joe Hammer is doing the engineering. The four acre lot has been owned for fourteen years. Re-zone -build house. He wants to change to three houses: two houses on 1/2 acre lots and one house on a three acre lot. The land is on septic and city water. McCurdy is talking to Ralph Pfister and they want him to change to city sewer. He will tap his septic tank to city sewer. Ultimately, all three houses would have city sewer and city water. Nanninga asked who will own lines. McCurdy stated that each owner will have his own pump as Joe Wywrot would rather have it this way and J.T. Johnson wanted three lines to tie into city sewer. At this point, Johnson stated that legally they have to tie them into city sewers. Wywrot stated gravity to SE sewer that goes in on ComEd might be an option. There was agreement that this would be looked at. McCurdy's lot is wooded and this could be hard to do. Now you have to have one acre for septic. McCurdy asked if he had to have sewer or if he could get a variance. Pfister stated that it was not his call if sewer is within 200 feet. Wywrot wants three lines and the City to not own them. f Plan Council 2/26/98 -Page 3 Nanninga stated that if the property is to be subdivided it has to be in the City. Johnson agreed that those lines are only as good as the people who maintain them. He also stated that he doesn't mind lift station with back-up power, etc. He doesn't have a big problem. Nanninga stated that the City will get called whether or not it's owned by the city. Johnson stated that gravity is still the best way. Wywrot stated he talked to EPA and if they pump to common main, city will have to take it over. McCurdy stated he would sign a statment obligating property owners to maintain the pumps. Johnson stated that he was not sure that gravity would work. Nanninga asked how will we work this. Johnson stated that we always want big acreage, but that isn't what happens. Nanninga asked if every home has to have its own line all the way back. Johnson replied yes. Wywrot stated that each service line would be 400 feet and we could do it with clean outs. Pfister stated that the ordinance doesn't say that. Johnson stated that at that time they can. McCurdy stated that it is 190' from property line to sewer main on Washington Street. Pfister stated that a small lift station might be okay. Johnson stated we have one now that has several failures every year. Nanninga stated that a single line is to be on our main on easement and then they split to three lines. He also stated that we need to investigate. Johnson is concerned with drainage when it over flows. The engineering is pretty significant. Hitzemann stated there are other issues such as the 115 feet driveway. McCurdy stated 130 feet. Hitzemann asked about location of last hydrant. Wywrot said 40 feet from end of the street. Johnson raised another concern regarding the cul-de-sac radius. McCurdy stated we looked at this as a split. Johnson stated that a variance of subdivision ordinance and a drainage/sewer and a variance those are big issues. McCurdy stated that the Plan Commission didn't have a problem with the concept. Johnson stated that we have already had to clean-up the gravel and debris. Discussion ensued by Johnson and McCurdy about the current flow of water. Tile has to be found. McCurdy replied so what you're saying is that what I'm doing could flood other neighbors. Nanninga asked McCurdy if McCurdy was saying he had addressed the problem. McCurdy discussed past problems and how the situation has since been addressed. Johnson stated that we need a utility easement to allow the City to get in there. Nanninga asked 20' easement. Johnson stated that's what he was thinking. Ditch and culvert only if we want to make it right. Pfister stated that we did pump some basements when the tile backed-up. Johnson stated that is has to be looked at closely if the storm water gets to the end of the street and we need easement for the future. Hitzemann when excavating we need to watch closely for field tile. Johnson stated that back lot lines go through vacant lot. If the City were to do this, it would go all the way to the creek or through trees. Wywrot stated that when the City widens and improves the street, we will need easement to handle the water. Planning Council 2/26/98 -Page 4 McCurdy wanted to know the use of the easement. Wywrot stated that it was the standard utility easement that he's looked at in subdivisions. The city sewer needs to be three lines to the city sewer. Letter of agreement would be appropriate to abandon and tie into sewer when line is available in back. Glick asked if in the very long run someone would re-subdivide, and from a land planning standpoint, a better lot size and remove some of these problems. Johnson talked about subdivision standards. Wywrot stated that there should be a broad enough storm sewer easement to discourage re-subdividing. Nanninga stated that any such re-subdividing would require a variance. Glick stated that saving the garage could cost more in the long run. Nanninga stated that the cul-de-sac is in our standards. Johnson said McCurdy was advised to do this twelve years ago for a cul-de-sac. The zoning book doesn't allow you to grant variances without meeting specific things. Nanninga said you're asking for this from the standpoint of firetrucks. These are tough issues. Subdivisions require sidewalks. The City Council has to address these issues. McCurdy stated that no one will be walking there. Johnson stated that this is a subdivision. Johnson stated that the Planning Commission looks at technical review. Wywrot stated that he will do a report and the Planning Commission and the City Council will have to make the final decision. Johnson stated that if fire department and EMS are happy with access and if Wywrot is happy with storm sewer, but it is still bending ordinance. Wywrot stated that we need more definition of how and where. Nanninga asked if McCurdy has looked at sanitary sewer and immanent sewer in back. McCurdy asked if there is something specific. Nanninga stated I think we should look at this now. Sewer is not iffy and he is starting in May. We need to let him know what we want. Graff stated that legally it doesn't meet the requirements. Wywrot stated that a temporary septic should go in until the line goes in. Pfister stated no septic tanks in the city limits. Wywrot stated three individual long water lines. Graff stated that we are going against ordinance to do this. Nanninga stated that we are not within standards. Come in with a PUD. We have to address sewer issue because it is not fair to let this go. McCurdy stated that he was confused. Wywrot stated that the plan is not ideal. There are plans in town like this and it would be best to be into sewer when line goes down ComEd. Graff stated back one more time. Nanninga stated should go to back. Does Planning Commission feel that way? Johnson stated that no problem with subdivide except that technically it doesn't comply with the subdivision ordinance. IIitzemann stated that fire dept won't raise an objection to long private driveways. Graff stated that there is a minimum on driveways for firetrucks. Glick commented build other two homes with different lot configuration. Nothing is standard on here to meet subdivision ordinance. This is a variance again. There are other ways to do this if you sacrifice this garage. Planning Council 2/26/98 -Page 5 McCurdy stated that the whole intention was to build a new home and one other house to eliminate future re-subdivision. Comments are there for Planning Commission. Johnson stated that out lot would address future re-subdividing. Wywrot stated that width of drives go to 12'. Hitzemann said that 12' is much better. Nanninga asked for any other new comments. Wywrot stated that there are several options and all have pros and cons. His next memo will be a report. Chris Glick left at 11:00 AM FOX HIGHLANDS - OFF SITE SANITARY SEWER Edmeier gave some catch-up information. January ComEd: 60-90 days and will start laying sewer. Working with Len and we have three points on sanitary line. Replacing gravity sewer proposed with Siebert. Wywrot stated that existing sanitary down street on Deer Street. Sanitary sewer is small force main one topic. Sewer in other direction. Temp line. Sure with it. Johnson stated that we might need permits from IDOT. Wywrot stated that fire department building will go to same manhole. Fairfield asked how long would be temporary. Edmeier stated that eventually to Hydraulic with rest of sewer. Dreas stated that PVC but in proximity of, change with valve in spots, 4" main. Hitzemann asked when. Dreas replied this summer. Hitzemann concerned about trenches in driveway. Dreas stated they will be in& out. Dreas also stated they will incorporate into plan. Discussion about pea rock. Hitzemann stated that he couldn't believe Beaver St. was ever built without any gravel. Be careful about base as it will disappear. Wywrot stated to make sure pipes go in first. Edmeier stated that before he gets to this point we will be in and out. Nanninga stated that if Edmeier is slowed down we could put in pipe. He then asked if we could go force all the way. If our sanitary is in good shape we can. He asked if there were any objections to going force all the way. As the sewer continues, this will be phased out. Dreas asked if we were locked in on easement plan . We asked because we could move things. Edmeier stated if city lives with this. Nanninga stated that it will be real hard to change it now. It could add two months. Edmeier stated okay, we're done. Nanninga asked if there was anything else on Edmeier. There were no other questions. OTHER BUSINESS GREEN-BRIAR Wywrot stated water main loop will rarely transport water, but is needed to keep pressure in the subdivision. Comments on some minor items. Location of property. 10'utility easement on the Planning Council 2/26/98 -Page 6 back side, off to west. Have to hug that easement. Talk to Langland, but he won't be happy. No good way to do it. Hug the easement and tunnel past tree. Put valve back there. Station hatch. OSHA safety equipment. Purpose of valve is to solve the problem of too high pressure on the main. Valve allows water to flow in both directions if it needs to. How does it function? Wywrot answered that if it is closed and it if senses pressure on Eliz, it would open and allow it to go in. Keeps pressure in mains @ 30-35 psi and maintains for fire, etc. Compromise of 500 GPM. Hitzemann stated that's okay for residential. Nanninga asked when. Joe stated we don't know because we need to get approved and get EPA approval. Johnson stated that it is same can as in industrial park. Wywrot stated that all you will see is a hatch and an exhaust vent. Johnson stated that E.F.I. did ours last so it should be the same. Nanninga asked if there was a key lock. Johnson answered yes. Graff asked if we can add an alarm on it. Johnson stated we can get to water from this. Graff asked how do we know if it fails. Johnson answered there are many ways. Nanninga asked if there was any additional business. Adjourned Minutes by Sandy Marker CITY OF YORKVILLE PLANNING COUNCIL February 26, 1998 SIGN IN SHEET PROJECT NAME (PLEASE PRINT!) REPRESENTING PHONE # f Yj, &Al �, F�►,�F��l� 1�Ic ��� � 5- 3 - 5-7-7 ` lF , 1 mdGt4 �vie �, � 4Je,S�'.�a 't► LE ti R F Ar s 2 ��F1- l�l c of WI�.I Eft. Tc3�C l7'�S� l f1-.yl�.S