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Fire and Police Commission Minutes 2001 11-07-01UNITED CITY OF Y ORIKVILLE POLICE AND FIRE COMMISSION TUESDAY, NOVEMBER 7TH, 2001 Chairman Commissioner Johnson called the meeting to order at 6:30 p.m. Member Roll Call: Commission Chairman President Bob Johnson—Present Commissioner Secretary Jim Jensen—Present Chief Harold Martin—Present Commissioner Margie Putzler—Present A quorum was established. Minutes: Commission Chairman Johnson motioned the minutes from October ls`be accepted and Commissioner Putzler seconded to accept the minutes. On a voice vote, all members present voting yes. Motion carried. Public Hear ine: There was no public hearing. Old Business: Chief Harold Martin stated that he had received communication from Seyfarth/Shaw regarding the IFC A. Bills For Payment: Commission Chairman Johnson stated that there has been a bill presented for the hotel. Chief Martin agreed. Unfinished Business: Commission Chairman Johnson stated that we are working on a draft of the rules/procedures. There has been information brought back on this from the conference. Everyone has been helpful on this. Commissioner Putzler stated that there are good contacts at these conferences. 1 Chief Martin agreed. Commissioner Jensen stated that we get free advice over the phone because of the association. Chief Martin stated that he wasn't aware of this, and thought it to be beneficial. Commissioner Putzler stated that we should direct the questions their first. Commission Chairman Johnson agreed. He then discussed the issue on the disciplinary action, and stated that Seyfarth and Shaw would support for the Chief. Chief Martin stated that we should leave this open for the attorney. Commission Chairman Johnson stated that there is nothing on the rules and regulations on this. Chief Martin agreed, and added that Seyfarth and Shaw is $250-300 per hour, and they also get a minimum. Commissioner Putzler stated that we would direct them to John Broihier. Chief Martin agreed. Commissioner Putzler then discussed page 9 of the letter, and stated that this would be chapter 6 section 1 letter N. Commissioner Jensen gave a description of this also. Commissioner Putzler stated that we could fax this, and fax it to Mr. Broihier. Chief Martin agreed. Commission Chairman Johnson stated that the `power test' has been discussed with someone on the training board. The test was created as a fitness test, and not created for the job related physical agility test. This is also reiterated in Roselle. They had been involved, and agreed that it is not job related. The recommendation is to use it as part if the information, or do it at the end as a condition of employment. I'm recommending using the power test. If we hire from another department, then there is no issue here. We ought to get feedback from the attorney on this. Let's check into this. Chief Martin agreed. Commissioner Jensen stated that if they cannot pass the PT1, then they are done. We might have some language changes then for the rules/regulations. 2 Commissioner Putzler discussed this further, stating that we have discussed this with Mr. Broihier. Chief Martin discussed the vision also, and stated that we would wait to hear information on this. Commission Chairman Johnson and Commissioner Putzler agreed. Commissioner Jensen asked if we should make PAT a condition of employment. Chief Martin stated that you would have to make the eligibility roster first. Commissioner Jensen stated that the initial roster covers the written and oral examinations. Then it goes in for the medical, vision, and the physical. Commissioner Putzler stated that this doesn't make sense in the logic though. She wondered why we have to wait. Commissioner Jensen stated that he would like to get a copy of the base law for things like this. We can determine this then. Commissioner Putzler agreed, and stated that we would check into this with Mr. Broihier then. Commissioner Jensen stated that we should give people the PAT before the medical, etc. Chief Martin agreed. Commission Chairman Johnson stated that the wording and the timing need to be changed. We need to get legal advice on this. Chief Martin agreed. Commissioner Putzler stated that we would put this on hold until we speak to the attorney. Commission Chairman Johnson stated that with the vision, it was recommended to have it certified and job related. We have found a vendor who provides the criteria and standards for this. Chief Martin and Commissioner Jensen stated that this has to be validated. This will defend it. It is a one-time cost, and it is an expert witness. We are not sure about the timeframe as of yet. Chief Martin stated that it was 1 ir-2 months. 3 Commission Chairman Johnson stated that the ISP uses it. New Lenox uses it also. Commissioner Jensen stated that we need to do this. Chief Martin stated that he would ask Larry Kat about this. Commissioner Putzler stated that they would give the specifics of this. She wondered if Brenart's would be able to do this. Commissioner Jensen asked if he would be able to validate this for police work though. Commissioner Putzler discussed the RK and Laser, stating that this still has problems with affecting the job. They would back us up on these different things. Commission Chairman Johnson stated that we would put this at the end where the medial examination section is. Commissioner Putzler stated that we want to move to chapter 3 section 9. Commission Chairman Johnson stated that we need to put in section 11 Chapter 3 when the time comes. He added that we should remove section 6. Commissioner Jensen agreed. It was changed to the validated test. Chief Martin stated that this is the initial part. If they have a validation, this would exclude them from the test. Commissioner Jensen stated that this would catch them ahead of time then. Commissioner Putzler stated that without the validation we couldn't do this. Commission Chairman Johnson stated that we should ask the attorney on this. Commissioner Jensen described chapter two, the appeal process. He added that with the polygraph exam, it has been used in Oswego, and it is approximately $100 per test. Commissioner Putzler wondered if correspondence is being dated and stamped. Chief Martin stated yes, that he is keeping this. Commissioner Jensen recommended not having the Chief involved in the interviews. He asked what the opinion was on this. Everyone agreed. 4 Commissioner Jensen strongly recommended videotaping the interviews. Commissioner Putzler discussed the probationary periods. Commissioner Jensen stated that there would be 10-12 weeks of training, and then the FTO program. Chief Martin agreed, and stated that this is part of the personnel policy. Commission Chairman Johnson stated that the council decides on this. Chief Martin agreed, and stated that he would speak to the labor attorney on this. Commissioner Putzler stated that with the standardized questions on the interview, what kind of consent do we need to get before, during, and the end. She also asked about the PTI training. Commissioner Jensen stated that this is in any training file, and the PTI. Commission Chairman Johnson asked if they have to be incorporated. Commissioner Putzler stated no. Commissioner Jensen stated that Chief Martin was going to check the policy for promotion. He wondered if the sergeants have to have a bachelor's degree. Chief Martin stated no. There is no conflict. There will be strong language to pursue a degree, but it is not stipulated. Commissioner Jensen wondered if there were extra points for this. Chief Martin stated no. Commissioner Putzler stated that she would fax the draft over then. Commissioner Jensen added that chapter 3 section 12 would need to be taken out, referring to the Fire Dept. Commission Chairman Johnson agreed. He added that with the grading scale, 70% would be the minimum. 70-75%is fair. Seasoned officers have a hard time passing this test. Commissioner Jensen agreed. Commissioner Putzler stated that we could be consistent within the guidelines. 5 Commission Chairman Johnson asked when we can meet to finish this, and added that we need to get the rules done first. He stated that this will need to be published for 10 days, and then we will talk about the testing process. We have not seen anything for the test questions from the Chief. Commissioner Jensen described the evaluation process sheet, and added that he liked the Joliet questions. Chief Martin stated that he does not have any suggested oral questions as of yet. He wanted to see what the commission was doing for this. Commissioner Putzler stated that she would phone Bob Scott about the interview questions. Commission Chairman Johnson stated that he would like to have three sets of questions—Joliet, Oswego, and the commission. Commissioner Jensen agreed. New Business: Commissioner Putzler stated that she had received the COPS testing. Chief Martin stated that he would like the breakdown of this. Commission Chairman Johnson stated that we could look into them for the different departments. Commissioner Jensen stated that these could be for promotional questions. Commission Chairman Johnson stated that we need to know what an adequate amount of questions would be. He asked about meeting for this. Commissioner Jensen suggested Tuesday the 13th. Commission Chairman Johnson stated that we need to get something into final form. Commissioner Jensen suggested the 14th at 7:00 p.m. Everyone agreed. Commissioner Putzler stated that she would get the faxed response and put it to the disk. Commission Chairman Johnson agreed. The 19th would be as a backup. I will announce the cancellation if need be. The written questions will be done for us also then. 6 Chief Martin stated that ICPA has the testing, and we go through them. Commissioner Jensen stated that the testing company that we have has a validated employee test though. Chief Martin stated that the standard associations use them, and all are multiple choices. We can grade or they can grade them. It would be $20 more per test. It would cost us 6,000-7,000 for the validation for our department. For the sergeants and lieutenants test, it is a one-time thing. It would be a $40 charge to change a question. Commission Chairman Johnson stated that we probably do not want this. He wondered what the advantage was to this. Chief Martin stated that it was the legality of this. Commissioner Jensen stated that this is geared for the larger departments. Chief Martin stated that as the department grows, you would add it on. I would suggest it because we want it to be right. Commission Chairman Johnson asked if it was in the budget right now. Chief Martin stated yes, and that he could get the figures together for this if need be. We are on a revised budget for this year. Commission Chairman Johnson asked if we need to do a waiver of the examination fee. He added that this would change the scenario. Chief Martin stated that there was no language incorporated on this. He wondered if there was a way to ask him if it is not a bad idea for the validation tests. I would like to go into this doing everything right. We want to be in a good position. Commissioner Putzler stated that she would find out about this. Commissioner Jensen stated that he would like an umbrella policy for himself The City cannot cover this under punitive damages. Commissioner Putzler asked if this needs to be added in the paragraph then. We can add it in chapter 2 section 2. Commission Chairman Johnson stated that we could talk to the attorney. We also need to ask about the release of liability. Also we will ask in regards to the badges for the interviews. 7 Additional Business: Commission Chairman Johnson stated that we would meet on November 14th at 7:00 p.m. This will include the follow up meeting on the 19th at 7:00 p.m. We will review the documents from the attorney and have the interview questions back from the towns to look at. Everyone agreed. Adjournment Commission Chairman Johnson asked for a motion to adjourn. Commissioner Putzler moved and Commissioner Jensen seconded to adjourn. On a roll call vote all members present votingyes. Motion carried. Meeting Adjourned at 9:05 p.m. Minutes by Lisa Sleezer 8 lc-,, 15 ouq,,, UNITED CITY of YORKVILLE o `"12-19-01 13 : 09 RCVD I County Seat of Kendall County v 800 Game Farm Rd.II Yorkville, IL 60560L L 630-553-4350 E OUNO,, 1N e,, PotrcE_ f We; the members of the A(£ C- m,rfioduCommittee-have reviewed the draft of the minutes from the i4-2 5-, //-7, i/-i V meeting. J2 --3 - 2vo / XWe have approved the minutes. We have asked for the minutes to be revised. indicating you have reviewed the minutes: al 7_ A-7_ Submitt- by: f/ /i k. ommittee Ch. ' ,der on