Planning and Zoning Commission Minutes 2023 11-08-23APPROVED 1/10/24
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PLANNING & ZONING COMMISSION
City Hall Council Chambers
651 Prairie Pointe Drive, Yorkville, IL
Wednesday, November 8, 2023 7:00pm
Meeting Called to Order
Vice-Chairman Richard Vinyard called the meeting to order at 7:00pm, roll was called
and a quorum was established.
Roll Call
Greg Millen-yes, Richard Vinyard-yes, Danny Williams-yes, Rusty Hyett-yes,
Reagan Goins-yes
City Staff
Krysti Barksdale-Noble, Community Development Director
Lynn Dubajic Kellogg, Economic Development Director
Other Guests
Christine Vitosh, Court Reporting Services
Jacob Victor, Northpointe Development
Lane Manning, DreamLane Real Estate
David Schultz, HR Green
Ron Luken, Chestnut Circle
Mr. Shawn Klingberg, Chestnut Circle
Tom Gilmour, Chestnut Circle
Judy Gilmour, Chestnut Circle
Alexandria Sandoval, YHS Intern
Joanne Kennedy?
Previous Meeting Minutes October 11, 2023
The minutes were approved on a motion by Mr. Williams and second by Ms. Goins.
Roll call vote: Vinyard-yes, Williams-yes, Hyett-yes, Goins-yes, Millen-yes. Carried 5-0.
Citizen’s Comments None
Public Hearings
Mr. Vinyard explained the procedure for taking testimony and swore in those who would
speak either for or against the Petition. A motion was made by Mr. Williams and
seconded by Ms. Goins to open the Public Hearing at approximately 7:03pm. Roll call:
Vinyard-yes, Williams-yes, Hyett-yes, Goins-yes, Millen-yes. Carried 5-0.
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Mr. Vinyard read the petition for the Public Hearing as follows:
1. PZC 2022-23 Jacob Victor, on behalf of Northpointe Development Corporation,
petitioner, has filed an application with the United City of Yorkville, Kendall
County, Illinois, requesting rezoning classification of an approximately 3.43-acre
parcel located at the southeast corner of Veteran's Parkway (U.S. Route 34) and
Sycamore Road in Yorkville, Illinois. The petitioner is seeking to rezone the
property from the B-3 General Business District to the R-4 General Multi-Family
Residence District. Additionally, the petitioner is requesting variance approval to
increase the maximum allowable density in the R-4 General Multi-Family
Residence District from eight (8) dwelling units per acre to fourteen (14) dwelling
units per acre. The purpose of the rezoning and variance requests is to establish
and operate a three (3) story, forty-eight (48) dwelling-unit senior Apartment
complex (Fox Hill Senior Living).
(See Court Reporter's transcript)
(Petitioner requested their responses to the rezoning and variance request to be included
in official record)
There was no further testimony and at approximately 7:35pm, Mr. Williams moved and
Ms. Goins seconded to close the Public Hearing. Roll call: Hyett-yes, Goins-yes,
Millen-yes, Vinyard-yes. Williams-yes. Carried 5-0.
Unfinished Business None
New Business
1. PZC 2022-23 Jacob Victor/Northpointe (see full description above)
Ms. Noble provided additional information about this petition. She described the
property as being 3.4 acres and the development will be a 3-story with 48 units. The
maximum density for R-4 is 8 units per acre and the petitioner is asking for 14. She said
all the other senior developments in the city exceed the 8 units per acre. In addition, she
said the maximum height for R-4 is 80 feet and this development would be 40-45 feet.
She described the surrounding land uses and provided the details for lot coverage,
parking, circulation, guest parking and trip generation studies. The primary access for the
development is off Sycamore Road. Staff was OK with the change of land use from
neighborhood retail and this change will be incorporated in the future Comprehensive
Plan revisions. Commissioner Hyett asked about the outside storage and Mr. Victor
replied that it is lockers on the first floor. Mr. Vinyard asked if a light study is required
and the petitioner will provide.
A study regarding aging in place was done recently and it addressed housing issues of the
aging. Participants commented they wanted more senior housing.
Action Item:
Rezoning Request
A motion was made by Mr. Williams and seconded by Ms. Goins to approve petition
PZC 2022-23 Northpointe Development rezoning request. The motion was read by Mr.
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Williams as follows: In consideration of testimony presented during a Public Hearing on
November 8, 2023 and approval of the findings of fact, the Planning and Zoning
Commission recommends approval to the City Council of a request for a map amendment
to rezone the parcel located at the southeast corner of US 34 and Sycamore Road (PIN
#02-30-203-006) from B-3 General Business District to R-4 General Multi-Family
Residence District.
Roll call: Hyett-yes, Goins-yes, Millen-yes, Vinyard-yes, Williams-yes. Carried 5-0.
Action Item:
Variance Request
A motion was made by Mr. Williams, seconded by Ms. Goins to approve PZC 2022-23
Variance Request. Mr. Williams read the motion as follows: In consideration of
testimony presented during a Public Hearing on November 8, 2023 and approval of the
findings of fact, the Planning and Zoning Commission recommends approval to permit an
increase in maximum dwelling unit density within the R-4 District from eight (8) units
per acre to fourteen (14) units per acre for the property located at the southeast corner of
US 34 and Sycamore Road (PIN #02-30-203-006).
Roll call: Hyett-yes, Goins-yes, Millen-yes, Vinyard-yes, Williams-yes. Carried 5-0.
2. PZC 2023-15 Luz M. Padilla, on behalf of Abby Properties, LLC, petitioner, is
seeking Final Plat approval for an approximately 9.4-acre site consisting of 44
single-family attached dwelling units and an open space lot within Phase 4 of the
Kendall Marketplace Townhome Development. The property is generally located
south of Blackberry Shore Lane and north of Gillespie Lane in Yorkville, Illinois
(Townes of Kendall Marketplace).
Ms. Noble said the petitioner is seeking Final Plat for the last phase of this townhome
development—Phase 4. It is comprised of 44 units and 1 unit for open space. The
previous phases, 1 through 3, hold 120 townhome units in various stages of construction.
In Phase 4, patios will be allowed, however, fences will not and language will be added
to individual plats to reflect this. Gillespie Road will be opened after Phase 4 is finished.
Action Item:
Final Plat
A motion was made and seconded by Mr. Williams and Ms. Goins, respectively, to
approve PZC 2023-15 Abby Properties Kendall Marketplace Lot 52 Phase 4. The
motion was read as follows by Mr. Williams: In consideration of the proposed Final Plat
of Subdivision for the Kendall Marketplace Development Lot 52, Phase 4, the Planning
and Zoning Commission recommends approval of the plat to the City Council as
presented by the Petitioner in a plan prepared by HR Green, dated last revised October 5,
2023.
Roll call: Goins-yes, Millen-yes,Vinyard-yes, Williams-yes, Hyett-yes. Carried 5-0.
Additional Business
1. 2024 Planning and Zoning Commission Meeting Schedule
All Commissioners were OK with the meeting schedule as presented.
Page 4 of 4
2. City Council Action Updates
Ms. Noble said PZC 2023-08 Ali Bukhres, special use for QuikTrip was approved.
PZC 2023-12 Alexander Berman, Kendall Holdings, final plat of resubdivision was
approved.
Adjournment
There was no further business and the meeting was adjourned at 7:52pm on a motion by
Mr. Williams and second by Mr. Hyett. with a unanimous voice vote.
Respectfully submitted by
Marlys Young, Minute Taker
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PZC - Public Hearing - November 8, 2023
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UNITED CITY OF YORKVILLE
YORKVILLE, ILLINOIS
PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION
PUBLIC HEARING
651 Prairie Pointe Drive
Yorkville, Illinois
Wednesday, November 8 , 2023
7 :00 p .m .
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PRESENT:
Mr. Richard Vinyard, Acting Chairman,
Mr. Danny Williams,
Mr. Greg Millen,
Mr. Rusty Hyett,
Ms. Reagan Goins.
ALSO PRESENT:
Ms. Krysti Barksdale-Noble, Community
Development Director;
Ms. Marlys Young, Minute Taker.
- - - - -
I N D E X
WITNESS: PAGE
JACOB VICTOR 6
LANE MANNING 9
TOM GILMOUR 20
SHAWN KLINGBERG 26
JUDY GILMOUR 31
- - - - -
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(WHEREUPON, the following
proceedings were had in public
hearing:)
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: There is one public
hearing scheduled for tonight's Planning and
Zoning Commission meeting. The purpose of this
hearing is to invite testimony from the members
of the public regarding the proposed request that
is being considered before this commission
tonight.
Public testimony from persons
present who wish to speak may be for or against
the request or to ask questions of the petitioner
regarding the request being heard. Those persons
wishing to testify are asked to speak clearly,
one at a time, state your name and who you
represent, if anyone. You are also asked to sign
in at the podium over here.
If you plan to speak during
tonight's public hearing as a petitioner or as a
member of the public, please stand, raise your
right hand and repeat after me.
(Witnesses sworn.)
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: Thank you. You guys
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can be seated. Okay. So the order for receiving
testimony during the public hearing tonight is
going to be as follows: The petitioner is going
to do their presentation, those two; the next are
those who wish to speak in favor of the request;
followed by those who wish to speak in opposition
of the request.
So may I have a motion to open the
public hearing on Petition number PZC 2022-23,
Northpointe Development Corporation, for rezoning
and variance?
MR. WILLIAMS: So moved.
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: All right.
MR. MILLEN: Second.
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: Beautiful. Roll call
on the motion, please.
MS. YOUNG: Yes. Vinyard.
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: Yes.
MS. YOUNG: Williams.
MR. WILLIAMS: Yes.
MS. YOUNG: Hyett.
MR. HYETT: Yes.
MS. YOUNG: Goins.
MS. GOINS: Yes.
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MS. YOUNG: And Millen.
MR. MILLEN: Yes.
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: So the public hearing
for tonight's discussion is as follows: PZC
2022-23, Jacob Victor, on behalf of Northpointe
Development Corporation, petitioner, has filed an
application with the United City of Yorkville,
Kendall County, Illinois, requesting rezoning
classification of an approximately 3 .43-acre
parcel located at the southeast corner of
Veteran's Parkway, U .S . Route 34, and Sycamore
Road in Yorkville, Illinois.
The petitioner is seeking to rezone
the property from the B -3 , General Business
District, to the R -4 , General Multi-Family
Residence District.
Additionally, the petitioner is
requesting a variance approval to increase the
maximum allowable density in the R -4 General
Multi-Family Residence District from eight
dwelling units per acre to 14 dwelling units per
acre.
The purpose of the rezoning and
variance requests are to establish and operate a
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three-story, 48-dwelling unit senior apartment
complex, Fox Hill Senior Living.
MR. VICTOR: Correct.
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: Is the petitioner for
PZC 2022-23, Northpointe Development Corporation,
ready to present?
MR. VICTOR: I am, and I have here one
of our development partners, Lane Manning, with
DreamLane Real Estate.
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: Okay, very good.
Please begin.
MR. VICTOR: Would you like us to stand
at the podium or --
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: Sure.
MS. NOBLE: Yes. You are going to have
to look at the presentation back here because we
don't have it on there. We can't double it up
yet.
JACOB VICTOR,
having been first duly sworn, testified from the
podium as follows:
MR. VICTOR: Good evening, everybody.
Thank you to the neighbors for coming out and
thank you all, to all the Plan Commissioners, for
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having us this evening.
Jake Victor, Vice President of
Development for Northpointe Development, and I
have here with me --
MR. MANNING: Lane Manning, principal,
DreamLane Real Estate.
MR. VICTOR: We are here before you to
discuss the property that was mentioned, where we
are proposing the development of Fox Hill Senior
Living, a 48-unit affordable housing, senior
affordable housing development here in
Yorkville.
Northpointe Development has been in
business for close to 20 years now. We have
about 3 ,000 units in our portfolio that we have
developed and a very strong reputation with the
communities which we have worked with.
Something that I kind of want to
highlight, take a step back on, before we get
into the full depth of the presentation, is our
approach as a community or as a developer is
really to identify a site, meet with the
community, meet with, you know, staff that work
for the community, and kind of talk about our
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site in mind at a high level before we go too far
down the process, kind of talk about the general
concept about -- of what we are proposing, so
that's exactly what we did here.
We had a neighborhood meeting as
well as, you know, Plan Council, Economic
Development Committee, trying to gather as much
feedback as we possibly could for our proposal
and incorporating that into the development.
MS. NOBLE: You can just tell me when.
MR. VICTOR: Sure. Yeah, absolutely.
These are just some example projects that we have
done. I always encourage plan commissioners and
city council members to reach out to the
communities in which we have worked with in the
past to kind of get a second opinion of us as a
developer, especially when we are new to a
community.
The feedback that I have received is
everyone is generally happy with us and very
satisfied with the product that we built, and I
think you'll see some of that in our presentation
here.
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LANE MANNING,
having been first duly sworn, testified from the
podium as follows:
MR. MANNING: My name is Lane Manning.
DreamLane Real Estate is my firm. I 've been
partnering with Northpointe since 2019, so we are
now on our 11th project, nine in Illinois -- or
Wisconsin, two in Illinois. I am also a state
certified developer in the state of Illinois.
I am really excited to work on this
project because I have a huge passion for senior
housing. It's a big thing for me, long story we
can share some other time, but I have a passion
for that and I am really excited about this site.
The site we are talking about in
question here on Veteran's Parkway and Sycamore
is really exciting. I love the way that the
topography works out. Right now it's a corn
field, so that image isn't up-to-date, but love
where it sits, in conjunction with the government
building, medical laboratory, the strip mall next
door and the housing right back to that.
I think it's a perfect location for
senior housing as we move forward, and as
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development across the street takes place. I
know we looked at that a lot when we were
imagining this site. There is a lot of
development going on and we are excited about
what could happen there, what this petition might
bring, track that development across the street.
MR. VICTOR: So to take a step back
really quick, if we could go back to the last
slide here, like Lane kind of pointed out, you
know, our company, we've done a lot of senior
affordable housing in our past, and I think what
we've done really well is positioning that in the
right spots in communities.
There is something really unique
about this site, more so than a lot of other, you
know, senior affordable housing developments that
we've done. It is currently zoned commercial,
but you have a little strip mall next door and it
has a number of vacant commercial spots in it,
but more than that, you have the park adjacent to
the property where we are proposing to do, you
know, a connection with a sidewalk on our
property, you have medical facilities next door,
so walking distance for the seniors here in the
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community to get to, you know, a hospital, to get
to medical doctor's appointments, et cetera, so
we were really excited about just the opportunity
to find a site in the community that, one, was
able to compete for tax credits from the state,
which is incredibly competitive, and, two, that
positioned seniors to live and also access
amenities right next to their home.
And that's just a general, a larger
picture look at this site as well.
So what are we talking here? We're
talking about 48 units. This is the general
site plan that you can see. 25 percent of the
units will be two-bedroom units and the rest will
be one bedrooms, all for seniors 55 years and
older.
We were able, and based off of the
feedback that we have received so far from the
community, to have two access points on the site
as well as, you know, a decent amount of
landscaping and gazebo space and community
gardens, et cetera, for our residents, really
trying to design this in a way based off of our
previous senior development that will be
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attractive for the senior population and also
accessible for them.
So this is just a look at the site
plan, which I 'm sure you all have seen at this
point.
This is a rendering of what we are
proposing there. Really beautiful architecture.
You'll see some renderings of the interior of the
units in a few minutes here, but like I said,
gazebo spaces, sidewalks connecting to the
neighboring park, you know, drop-off area for
seniors, et cetera.
So do you want to talk a little bit
about the community space that we typically
offer?
MR. MANNING: Sure. Sure. So this is a
slide, a couple slides, of some of our finishes.
Generally a lot of laminates, pool t ables,
activities, TV screens, with a full kitchen, so
you can have a gathering space.
That bottom one is one of our newer
developments in Wisconsin, came out really,
really well. TVs . We were there the other day
and a lot of activity comes there, people playing
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cards, pool table. We've got some pretty serious
games they have in that community room, I 'm here
to tell you.
The one on the right is kind of --
some of the paint colors that we typically use,
typically neutral paint colors. I wouldn't say
trendy so much, but things that would kind of fit
into the trends, but have longevity, lasting
impressions.
The floor, slide on the right, is
our -- the laminate that we've been using.
MR. VICTOR: Quartz.
MR. MANNING: Quartz, and quartz
countertop we've been using in a lot of our
properties. You can see the appliances and some
of the light fixtures that we've been able to
install in some of our senior properties.
Paint the cabinets. We try to put
color on cabinets, a trendy color on cabinets,
try to give it a little bit of personality, have
a little bit of longevity along the way.
MR. VICTOR: So these are some actual
renderings of a previous project that we
completed. Something that I like to emphasize,
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especially when we are doing senior housing, is
not only do we typically include, you know, large
units, nice finishes in the actual units, but
when it comes to the common space, you know, my
whole concept is health and wellness of our
residents, pulling them outside of their unit,
providing them space to collaborate with one
another, looking at the potential of partnering
with local non-profits to provide, you know,
community rooms and such, community rooms,
fitness rooms, large gathering spaces, not just
outside where -- that you all saw on the site
plan, but also inside the building. Really just
emphasizing being together and outside of folks'
units.
MR. MANNING: Another -- I 'll add to
that. We have a development in one of our towns,
it has a -- the town itself has an electric cycle
initiative, so they have I think it's 15 stations
around the community where they have electric
rental cycles.
One of the things we were able to do
in that community was we got with that --
partnered with that, it's called E -Cycle. We put
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four stations on the senior development, and we
just got numbers today. I was actually impressed
with how much the usage was. It was right there
in the middle with the other 14 stations in the
community, so they are on the bike paths, they're
-- and that's an amenity, it's free, so we
negotiated with the tenants of that development
to use that bike for free.
It's hour time tracks, but we
have -- their use was right in the middle of the
other 14 sites, which is very, very promising.
So we think creative, we try to keep our seniors
active.
MR. VICTOR: So like I mentioned
earlier, 48 units, 36 one-bedrooms, 12
two-bedroom units, you know, large units, at
least 725 square feet for a one bedroom, thousand
square feet for a two bedroom.
We are adequately parking the site.
I think it's , you know, probably over parked, but
we wanted to do that just because of all the
activity in the community. We don't want folks
parking on streets, we don't want folks, you
know, causing congestion, so we are over parking
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the site just to ensure that the site has
adequate parking and is not -- you know, traffic
is not interfering with neighbors as much.
The building will be certified under
Enterprise Green Communities. That just means,
you know, a much higher threshold for
sustainability, green areas like I showed you on
the site plan, walking paths, balconies for all
the units.
We are going to prioritize those who
already live or work in the city of Yorkville,
you know, specifically seniors. I think that's
something that I like to do in a lot of
communities just to make sure that when we are
building a project like this, it's really for the
community itself, it's not for -- you know, it's
obviously open to folks in other communities as
well, but prioritizing your seniors first. We
use local laborers, contractors.
Exterior storage, so, you know,
seniors moving out of their single family homes
into our building have adequate space to store
all their stuff and don't have to keep that all
in their unit actually.
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Non-smoking, in-unit washers,
dryers, stainless steel appliances. You kind of
saw the finished package that we typically
incorporate into our projects.
And then, most importantly, we have
on-site professional third-party management
that's on-site, has an office there, is dealing
with, you know, tenants on a regular basis,
helping tenants connect with, you know, services
in the area, your senior center, you know,
coordinating with them.
We really push our on-site property
management to go a little bit above and beyond
just, you know, managing daily operations of the
property, but also, you know, collaborating with
tenants to provide those services and connections
in the community.
I think that's a really important
piece of what we do really well, is just on-site
property management and pushing them to kind of
excel a little further than typical.
So these are incoming rent limits.
These are the maximum incomes that folks can
be -- seniors can be earning in units. We have
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about 12 30-percent AMI units; 13 50-percent; six
60-percent; and 17 80-percent units, so really
providing a wide diversity of housing types and
housing for seniors across the income spectrum
here.
Those maximum rents that you see
there, those are maximums. Obviously we're going
to, you know, price the apartment units to be in
line with what the market actually is here, but
those are the statutory maximums that we are
allowed to charge.
That's a look inside of one of our
units. This is a rendering from the same project
I showed you earlier. Once again, you know, nice
large units, quartz countertops, nice finishes,
stainless steel appliances, really providing
somewhere where your seniors can feel proud to
call home.
And this is just our general time
frame that we have followed so far. Plan
Commission, Economic Development Committee, we
did a neighborhood meeting earlier this year, now
Plan Commission and City Council, and if approved
at both this meeting and the City Council
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meeting, we will be starting construction in
April of 2024.
This is the last slide. Something
that I do want to note is we --
MS. NOBLE: Two more.
MR. VICTOR: Yeah.
MS. NOBLE: Okay.
MR. VICTOR: T hose were in case any
questions were asked. We did receive an award of
housing tax credits from the Illinois Housing
Development Authority. Just so you are all
aware, incredibly competitive process. Typically
I believe in those last rounds over subscribed in
those communities about three to one, so really a
significant resource that you now have in your
community that the state wants to deploy here to
build more senior affordable housing.
In meeting with Krysti and other
staff I 've heard loud and clear that, you know,
the community has organized and, you know, come
together to try to, you know, promote the
development of senior housing.
You all have a couple senior
projects in the community already, pretty much
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all of them are 100 percent occupied with waiting
lists. There is, you know, a pretty significant
demand here, which you all know better than me,
so that's kind of what we got. Open for
questions.
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: Is there -- You guys
can be seated for now.
MR. VICTOR: Sure. Thank you.
MR. MANNING: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: You are welcome. Is
there anyone present who wishes to speak in favor
of the request?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: All right. Is there
anyone present who wishes to speak in opposition
of the request?
MR. KLINGBERG: I don't have an
oppositional favor, I just have a couple
questions, so --
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: Okay. Mr. Gilmour,
would you like to speak?
TOM GILMOUR,
having been first duly sworn, testified from the
podium as follows:
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MR. GILMOUR: My name is Tom Gilmour and
I do have a few questions. In the material that
I have here it said age restrictive, 65 years
old, not 55. Which one is it going to be? That
would be one question.
And is there any limitation on how
many people are living in the units? I assume if
they are 65 years old they're not raising a
family. How many people are actually going to be
residing in these units, including the two
bedroom?
Another question -- I am assuming
you've covered this -- is the fire department,
it's been okayed with three story so they can
access it, a sprinkler system? That's part of
our code I believe.
And are there going to be any meals
provided or anything other than just a community
room for the residents?
I 'll give him a second to answer the
question.
MS. NOBLE: Jake, do you --
MR. VICTOR: Sure. I was just taking
notes. I wasn't sure if you wanted me to answer
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directly.
MS. NOBLE: Sure. You can answer the
direct question.
MR. VICTOR: Sure. So the first
question was 55 plus or 6 5 plus. You do have the
existing affordable senior development in the
community, Anthony Place, and that is 55 plus, so
we will be meeting -- matching that and doing 55
plus.
MR. GILMOUR: You were asking for a
pretty generous concession on the zoning density.
I don't think it's asking too much to spell that
out a little more.
MR. VICTOR: Sure. My apologies.
MR. GILMOUR: 6 5 , make the deal.
MR. VICTOR: Sure. The second question
was how many people per unit. Our management
company puts a very strict limit on two people
per bedroom, but with a senior development, we
don't come anywhere near that.
I don't have the statistics, I
probably should have included those in the
presentation, but it is significantly less in our
senior portfolio, so that's the absolutely
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maximum, but --
MR. GILMOUR: Senior residents and
assuming it's a couple, for example, just a
couple, it's not the whole family --
MR. VICTOR: Correct. Correct.
MR. GILMOUR: -- and everybody else.
MR. VICTOR: Correct.
MR. GILMOUR: And some hard explanation
and understanding exactly what this is going to
be about.
MR. VICTOR: Absolutely. Our management
company puts house rules in place that limits it
at two individuals per bedroom.
MR. GILMOUR: That can say a lot,
doesn't it, that you could scratch your head.
You've got a two-bedroom unit, you've got two
bedrooms, that's four people.
MR. VICTOR: Sure.
MR. GILMOUR: If they are retiring at
65 years old, it sounds like there is another
family there, so let's clear that up.
MR. VICTOR: Absolutely. I can provide
you with the statistics and the Plan Commission
with those based off of our portfolio, but like I
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said, I don't have those handy , but I can tell
you with certainty that it's less than two people
per bedroom.
MR. GILMOUR: My recommendation would be
is that's a condition of approval of this thing.
They are getting a big concession on the density
in the first place. That's the rules. They can
follow them. That would be my advice.
MR. VICTOR: And I believe the last
question was meals provided.
MR. MANNING: Fire department.
MR. VICTOR: Yes, the fire department
will have to approve as part of the permitting
process, and three stories is allowed under the
zoning district I believe.
MS. NOBLE: The Fire District was part
of the Plan Council, which is a staff-level
technical review, and they had expressed no
concerns over the height. The maximum height in
the district is 80 feet, or three stories.
MR. GILMOUR: Well, just the occupancy,
a real clear understanding of exactly what this
is supposed to be. A retirement thing, that's
what you are selling it as, not like oh, I
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brought my nieces and nephews with me or whoever
else. We would like to know exactly a little
more about the population of it.
Are you going to provide any
services like food or anything other than the
general recreation area for the people?
MR. VICTOR: That was your last question
I believe, and we do -- we have provided and
partnered with programs like Meals on Wheels
before.
It's not something that we are
currently planning on doing, but, you know,
connections to organizations like that are --
more than happy to incorporate that into the
project.
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: Anything else, sir?
MR. GILMOUR: I think that's about it.
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: Thank you.
MR. VICTOR: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: You would like to
come to the podium and speak? Thank you.
MR. KLINGBERG: Sure.
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: Can you state your
name for us as well?
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MR. KLINGBERG: Shawn Klingberg.
SHAWN KLINGBERG,
having been first duly sworn, testified from the
podium as follows:
MR. KLINGBERG: I 'm going to be looking
at this monstrosity going up in my back yard, so
that's my view. So you're starting it in April
of '24. When are we planning on finishing this?
MR. VICTOR: Take about 12 months, so
April of '25.
MR. KLINGBERG: April of '25?
MR. VICTOR: Correct.
MR. KLINGBERG: Okay. And then what are
we going to do so I don't have to watch all this
stuff going up in my back yard? Because I sit in
my back yard every night, have a cigar and a few
beers. I work construction for a living, I don't
want to look at work when I come home, so, I
mean, are we going to have some sort of fencing
up with some sort of blockade so I don't -- you
know what I mean?
MR. VICTOR: Sure.
MR. KLINGBERG: Just to keep all the --
MR. VICTOR: We will be required to do
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general construction fencing by the city.
MR. KLINGBERG: And then what hours are
you guys planning to work on this? Because, you
know, Saturday morning --
MR. VICTOR: Yep.
MR. KLINGBERG: -- I don't want to hear
nothing at 7 :00 o 'clock in the morning.
MR. VICTOR: It's pretty hard to get my
subs to work on Saturdays.
MR. KLINGBERG: Well, pretty much time
and a half. I mean, I work every Saturday,
Sunday is double time, so --
MS. NOBLE: We do not allow construction
over the weekend.
MR. KLINGBERG: Okay. So it's Monday
through Friday construction schedule.
MS. NOBLE: Monday through Friday.
MR. KLINGBERG: That's what I want to
know. And then why are we going three stories?
Because the other retirement center is two
stories, so why -- you know, since they are
keeping the age limit the same, why aren't we
keeping the height restriction the same?
MR. VICTOR: Yeah, the biggest driver to
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that is that project was done three or four
years -- I believe four years ago.
MS. NOBLE: It was actually done in
2015, 2016.
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: 2015.
MR. VICTOR: Construction costs have
just skyrocketed since then. We are trying to
provide the same -- nicer level of finishes for
our tenants, but three stories is really the only
way to make the affordable housing project work.
MR. KLINGBERG: Well, I 'd like to keep
everything -- because everything else around
there is either a ranch or two story. I think we
should keep everything at the same level. There
is no reason to put a taller building into a
community that's all two level building site
zoned, so that's why -- I mean, to be honest with
you, at the end of the day, your construction
costs, it's not my pig, it's not my farm.
My view of my community and the view
of my neighbors ' community, everybody is at two
stories. Figure out the costs and a way to do
it.
MR. VICTOR: Sure.
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MR. MANNING: What was your name?
MR. KLINGBERG: Shawn Klingberg.
MR. MANNING: How tall is the hospital
next door? Is that three stories? Wasn't that
there --
MR. KLINGBERG: I was not living there
when that hospital was built.
MR. MANNING: When you are in your back
yard --
MR. KLINGBERG: I cannot see the
hospital.
MR. MANNING: You can't see that?
MR. KLINGBERG: No, because they have
the hospital hidden with all the tree lines and
everything, so if you look at all the tree
lines -- I live at 136 1 Chestnut Circle. You are
more than welcome to come over to my back yard,
we can sit back there, we can have a cigar and
beer and you can see what my concerns are and you
can see what my neighbors ' concerns are.
MR. MANNING: So what we've done in a
couple of developments, this is kind of back to
what we were are saying how we work with our
communities. We had an individual who had a
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garage next to our development who wanted to put
solar up and there was a tree there.
On our properties we keep the trees
when somebody asks us to keep the tree, but he
wanted to obviously make the solar work, so we
got together a group, community approved it, to
move that landscaping points to move that, and we
removed the tree so we can make it solar. We
would offer you the same thing. If there was an
obstruction or get some fencing, we would help
you figure out whatever --
MR. KLINGBERG: No, that's fine. I
mean, that's the whole reason why we all moved
into a completed unit -- a completed community,
is because we don't want to hear construction.
If we wanted to hear construction, we would go
live in a construction zone. I mean, 90 percent
of my community is all retirees, I mean -- I
think I 'm the 7 0 and older community, so --
MR. MANNING: You need our housing.
MR. KLINGBERG: Well, I don't . I mean,
I 'm still 49. You are putting me in a senior in
six years, I 'm not a big fan of that.
MR. MANNING: Your neighbors are.
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MR. KLINGBERG: I just want to make sure
everybody is not having to deal with the growing
pains of a construction site in their back yard.
MR. MANNING: Absolutely.
MR. KLINGBERG: Because I do work
construction and I know.
MR. VICTOR: Appreciate it.
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: Thank you. Anybody
else? Ms. Gilmour?
JUDY GILMOUR,
having been first duly sworn, testified from the
podium as follows:
MS. GILMOUR: My name is Judy Gilmour.
We were kind of blindsided about this. We didn't
get a letter, and I was kind of surprised to find
out that you had a community meeting, and I don't
know which community you met with, but it
wasn't -- I don't believe it was anybody in our
Chestnut Circle area that I know of, so who did
you meet with?
MR. VICTOR: We sent out mailers based
off of what the city's --
MS. NOBLE: 500.
MR. VICTOR: I think I actually -- I did
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double that.
MS. GILMOUR: I know you sent those
letters, but you said you had a community
meeting?
MR. VICTOR: Yes. We sent those letters
to folks that live within a thousand feet of the
property.
MR. KLINGBERG: I got one.
MS. GILMOUR: I knew you sent the
letter, but you said you had a meeting with the
community.
MS. NOBLE: January.
MR. VICTOR: Yes. It would have been
sent at the end of December, beginning of January
before the neighborhood meeting.
MS. GILMOUR: So you did have a
neighborhood meeting?
MR. VICTOR: Yes. We had the
neighborhood meeting, mailers were sent to folks
that live within a thousand feet of the property.
MS. GILMOUR: Well, I must be just
like -- just beyond that because I am right there
on Chestnut Circle, so --
MR. VICTOR: My apologies.
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MS. GILMOUR: Now, you mentioned
exterior storage. Did you have a slide with that
picture?
MR. VICTOR: The exterior storage?
MS. GILMOUR: Yes.
MR. VICTOR: So when I say exterior,
it's exterior to the unit itself, so it's
contained within --
MS. GILMOUR: Okay. It's not a separate
area, okay.
MR. VICTOR: Right.
MS. GILMOUR: And now, you are the
developer?
MR. VICTOR: That's correct.
MS. GILMOUR: And are you planning to
sell this to somebody else?
MR. VICTOR: We are not allowed to sell
the building.
MS. GILMOUR: Okay. So you will be
involved with it the whole time then.
MR. VICTOR: Correct. Correct.
MS. GILMOUR: Okay. Thank you.
MR. VICTOR: Thank you for your
questions.
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CHAIRMAN VINYARD: Would anyone else
like to speak in opposition to the request?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: All right. Are there
any questions from the commissioners for the
petitioners ?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: I 've got one. There
is no like assisted living, this is strictly
people who can care for themselves, you don't
have any units that -- so just basically a senior
living center without any sort of other help,
correct?
MR. VICTOR: That's correct.
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: Okay.
MR. WILLIAMS: And I did just think of
one, and this might help clarify Mr. Gilmour's
question as well. You said it was two --
MR. KLINGBERG: Can you speak up a
little?
MR. WILLIAMS: Oh, yes, I 'm sorry. And
this mic probably is off.
MS. NOBLE: That one, Dan, with the
green.
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MR. WILLIAMS: Green light?
MS. NOBLE: Yes.
MR. WILLIAMS: Thank you. That's
better. What I was going to ask is in regards to
the two person per bedroom policy, is there an
age limit to that as well?
Because I think Mr. Gilmour's
concern was that families could be moving in with
children or something like that.
MR. VICTOR: Yes.
MR. WILLIAMS: Is it 55 across the
board?
MR. VICTOR: Yes, 55 across the board.
MR. WILLIAMS: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: Thanks.
MR. GILMOUR: Where did 6 5 disappear to?
Right in the information I have here, it was 65
years old.
MS. NOBLE: Where do you have 65?
MR. WILLIAMS: I had seen 55.
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: Yes.
MR. GILMOUR: I got it from your office
last week.
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: Could you -- what
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page is that, Mr. Gilmour?
MS. NOBLE: Yes, can you show me?
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: There is so much to
it, it just kind of -- it helps us streamline and
find it.
MR. GILMOUR: That's a pretty big one.
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: Agreed.
MR. GILMOUR: You've got to read this
stuff, Krysti, before you start presenting it.
MS. NOBLE: I do read it, Tom. I do.
That's their response, not staff's response. It
was in response, in one of your variances.
MR. VICTOR: Sure.
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: It was not the
staff's response?
MS. NOBLE: It was not staff's response.
Staff's understanding has always been it's 55
plus --
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: Okay.
MS. NOBLE: -- as we've been told, and
that is what the public hearing stated --
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: Okay.
MS. NOBLE: -- for 55 plus. Staff --
MR. MANNING: Mistake on our part.
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MR. MILLEN: I 'd like to actually --
MR. GILMOUR: So it's 55?
MR. VICTOR: 55.
MR. MILLEN: I 'd like to actually say
something about 55. My sister probably is in a
situation who could maybe afford conventional
housing, she does have some disabilities, but she
is very capable of living on her own. She is
just short of 6 0 , and she had to get on a wait
list for a property similar to this in Oswego.
Honestly, I picked her up for her
birthday. She can't say enough about this type
of living, from the bingo events to, you know,
the gatherings, so I don't know if 55 is a big
stretch. She probably is the youngest at 6 0 , so
I don't know if that's a real big hardship, and
just seeing it firsthand, the joy that it brings
her to have that companionship, and it's a relief
for me, too, I do visit with her, spend time with
her, keep in touch with her, but I think there is
other things when you see that facet and
understand that, how it affects that age group,
because at 7 5 , 8 5 , sometimes the parents are
deceased, and then you've got those kids that are
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between 55 and 6 5 that aren't in a position to
afford housing, housing is expensive, so I don't
think that's a big deal. But just my two cents.
MR. MANNING: Thank you.
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: Okay. Anybody else?
(No response.)
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: No. Petitioner,
would you like the responses to the variance and
rezoning standards entered into the record?
MR. VICTOR: Yes.
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: Okay. Very good. So
this will be the conclusion of the public
hearing.
Since all public testimony regarding
this petition has been taken, may I have a motion
to close the taking of testimony in this public
hearing?
MR. WILLIAMS: So moved.
MS. GOINS: Second.
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: Roll call vote on the
motion, please.
MS. YOUNG: Hyett.
MR. HYETT: Yes.
MS. YOUNG: Goins.
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815.993.2832 cms.vitosh@gmail.com
PZC - Public Hearing - November 8, 2023
39
MS. GOINS: Yes.
MS. YOUNG: Millen.
MR. MILLEN: Yes.
MS. YOUNG: Vinyard.
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: Yes.
MS. YOUNG: And Williams.
MR. WILLIAMS: Yes.
CHAIRMAN VINYARD: All right. So the
public hearing portion of tonight's meeting is
concluded.
(Which were all the proceedings had
in the public hearing portion of
the meeting.)
---o 0 o ---
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PZC - Public Hearing - November 8, 2023
40
STATE OF ILLINOIS )
) SS:
COUNTY OF LASALLE )
I , CHRISTINE M . VITOSH, a Certified
Shorthand Reporter of the State of Illinois, do
hereby certify:
That previous to the commencement
of any testimony heard, the witnesses were duly
sworn to testify the whole truth concerning the
matters herein;
That the foregoing public hearing
transcript, Pages 1 through 41, was reported
stenographically by me by means of machine
shorthand, was simultaneously reduced to
typewriting via computer-aided transcription
under my personal direction, and constitutes a
true record of the testimony given and the
proceedings had;
That the said public hearing was taken
before me at the time and place specified;
That I am not a relative or employee or
attorney or counsel, nor a relative or employee
of such attorney or counsel for any of the
parties hereto, nor interested directly or
indirectly in the outcome of this action.
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PZC - Public Hearing - November 8, 2023
41
I further certify that my certificate
attached hereto applies to the original
transcript and copies thereof, signed and
certified under my hand only. I assume no
responsibility for the accuracy of any reproduced
copies not made under my control or direction.
IN WITNESS WHEREOF, I do hereunto set my
hand at Leland, Illinois, this 13th day of
November, 2023.
__________________________________
CHRISTINE M. VITOSH,
C.S.R. Certificate No. 084-02883
/s/