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EDC Minutes 1996 07-03-96 UNITED CITY OF THE VILLAGE OF YORKVILLE Committee Minutes - Economic Development Special Meeting - South Sanitary Sewers & Developers Date of Meeting: July 3, 1996 Location: 111 W. Fox Time Convened: 2:00 PM Time Adjourned: 4:00 PM Attendees: Matt Fiscone, Inland Bill Roppolo, Roppolo Tom Greyer Joe Edmeier, Edmeier Group Joe Wywrot Kathy Jones Dan Kramer Jerry Lynch Art Prochaska Ralph Pfister J.T. Johnson Bill Schmanski Barb Dwyer Jim Nanninga William Davis Discussion: 1). Sanitary Sewer Needs for Proposed & Future Development Two parts of town have big lines, going SE & N we need two things & have no money. Dean Edmeier talked about front ending money for line with recapture. We would allow 100% recapture and give interest. Timing is a problem. We need the capacity now, Joe Wywrot did work for East/West leg, if we got the North/South line to get things down to VanEmmon, there is still inadequate capacity. Need information on that. Criteria now is that we close that line off to any further development. Joe: The bottom line is that even after repairs there are portions of that sewer could sur- charge during a storm & peak flow times. inflow of drain water into sanitary sewers. Looking at the lines along Hydraulic and VanEmmon, city cannot recommend any additional add -on, there is too much risk that the line would sur- charge, even after making repairs there is no room for additional growth, adding growth to it will make it worse. Question: Which line were you speaking? Referencing: this is the line on hydraulic that goes down to Mill St., and down to Van Emmon. Where is the Bottle neck? There is really one long bottle neck, this is the worst at the 90, and JT verified that this is an 8" that was laid a little flatter that it should have been, and there is virtually no flow, but as you get down stream there is existing flow carried by the pipe. Starting at Mill St., you have a 12" line that carries flow from all these properties, and then you go on down 47 and you add some more, and then more and more, so as the line gets bigger and bigger, you are gobbling up that additional capacity with additional juice, so you really don't add any additional capacity. It a fairly constant problem, and after we do the project it i would operate just at capacity. Some people at the city thought we had some time on the East/West interceptor, that it came with a mechanism to go N/S with the big line out to the SE, and then building up to the E/W interceptor, and it looks like on the E/W we do need a new line along Hydraulic, and the area that line would service that Joe has spoken with Jim would benefit not only the SE, but if it was put in big enough that any problem developing North of the river would ultimately come down to that, and there would be recapture on that, but the big problem is the front end cost. Some real rough number are $1,000,000. for N /S, and $500,000. for E/W, but that is not to a T or anything. That would have to be engineered, and When Dean said that perhaps that could be done from your firm, I think that he was offering to front the N /S, and that we could do the E/W when we get some time, but we are looking at getting the whole thing front ended to get it done. There is not a lot of interim measures that can be taken, and Doc Davis just came in, and on his and Barb Dwyer, on your subdivision you are obviously going through one line now and on your existing units you are going to run out of capacity, but when those phases that are now in operation are done, they are going to be shut off until a new line is put in. From Coach Road Hills, there is a possibility of at least taking a phase to the West and having a lift station, but they would not want to commit to more than one phase and that would take Council action to do that, but what they would be looking on from your end Bill, if they agreed to do a phase to the West would be that you would pay the recapture to looking into the West and pay on a permit basis going to the East as well. you know, because eventually they have to get you on that East line and not the West. Question: What kind of money are we looking at? Well, right now the real rough numbers we have in the West and I guess its not so rough is 3.5 p per house and 200p w/ inflation about 1300 per unit, and on the East again, that would depend on what the cost is, but that was when you were looking at the N/S or E/W, and Hydraulic is going to kick that up higher. Yes, 300 (meaning $300,000.) was everything. Figures are cursory. Would the Commercial be in Phase I ? No. We could work that out, to get commercial in Phase I? JT: I'm sure we could. So that the number we have to be looking at up front in cost, Joe ?, and of course all of this is presumptive of getting the easement from ComEd. Talked to Bob Larson, yes he is the one we initially dealt with, but I talked to a guy in Chicago in charge of Real Estate, and the thing I told Joe and Jim is that if we do this as a city project between up and Com Ed, the cost if any would be much different than if any developer going to ComEd and says they need to do it, so. The approach would be - as the project (as far as ComEd would be concerned) the easement would run to the city, but again if it was someone fronting the project (the money on the project) it would be done as a private project, as was done with FE Wheaton then it could be built cheaper privately. Question: What about the access road. past the pump - to the lift station. we would need a maintenance road. We have easement, and again hopefully they would go along. Its OK as the plans are now. Show Doc Davis on the map where boundary line is ... Doc Davis complaining that deals have already been made, etc. re: some of his land, (and yet he still owns it), complaining about new people, not keeping old deals. the city goes by what is documented. JT, from memory - - Doc, it must have been your engineer, at least it should have been. There is one item in writing, that we can go back to, and have pulled it out several time for him, but we don't want to get off the point of this new line, as this won't interfere with your residential in Wildwood, but you've got the commercial area along 71 & 126 ?, that would in an area that wasn't intended to be served by the line that now goes through Wildwood, that again ultimately would be affected by this and Barb Dwyer, your commercial and your second phase of anything you do would be affected, the existence or non - existence of a new line, obviously that's I why Matt is here from Inland, because it affects their triangle, and it affects their parcel, and this radically affects Joe & Bill's proposal. Again, the city will look at the options Bill of giving you a unit, depending on how many PE and how many units that go West, but like I said the thing you would have to look at is you would pay the recapture, because we are governed by 2 loans agreements from the City invoked by the State loan, and EDC loan, that was made by the county on the line going South.... charge anyone that hooks in going West of 47 recapture, and then again on a PE basis, East, but then again that is not a permanent solution, that would only be a unit and again you would have to figure out the PE, and get it approved by Joe as the city engineer. From the Edmeier Groups proposal, again we think you basically have got to go on the new line from the get -go Joe, from you and Dean's point of view, and that's whether you develop or Doetschmann did it himself, as the land owner, and frankly anybody out there. It makes sense to get it done, I realize dollars are in short supply anywhere, but when Dean made that offer (I hope you're not taking it out of his salary), that broke the log jam, and so we went back to the city engineer. And, unfortunately what has happened since Dean came in, and now is that they shot the grades on that line that it is in worse shape, but as far as capacity, we are hoping to be able to time it out and delay that until there were maybe loans or another source, so if you could talk it over with Dean, and see if you are still interested in fronting something, we would need that answer, and if they could commit to that, then the city will seriously discuss letting you go with the unit West. Plus everybody out there knows they are going to have sanitary sewer service. The city needs 1/2 million, even with Edmeier. The West one was done, Recapture based on a PE, with a flat rate per acre, and payable at time of permit. That was the original ordinance. Again on the East, all cost and recaptured ( Edmeier) Re: 1/2 Million, the East line is now a city line and replaced, it needs to be 48 ", sanitary or city? can SD fund any of it. Chance of recapture by anyone who fund it are slim ... this area is only 10% of it, a 48" would also service any line brought from the North also. Line has to be replaced so dig it up once and do it the size that will be needed within the next few years. Can't recapture from existing residents. Recapture over next 20 years. City would give Edmeier or anyone who funds 20 years for maximum recapture. Credit for tap ons: can people who fund get part of repayment from existing tap on fees. Ralph: That money $900. per house plus $200., we can look at that if someone comes in and advances money, uping those fees could be negotiated. Discussed areas of recapture and areas that are not recapturable. Briefly touched on Doc Davis' agreement, and it has been taken out and looked at on several occasions based on his complaints of not keeping agreement. North/South line is purely for the benefit of new developers. The 48" line would benefit old existing and also the new. Existing residents cannot be taxed, and it cannot be a bond issue. The primary issue is the line for Hydraulic, and putting in a line only to accommodate the current needs - a good guess is 24 ", but in order to meet the need estimated within the next few years the increase to 48" would handle this. This would also make it fundable since it would benefit new developers. The cost would be greater, but doing it now is the sensible time, difference in cost of these two sizes is that the 24" line would cost $350,000. and for an additional $100,000. you get a line that will accommodate the coming needs and avoid tearing up Hydraulic now and again in two years. Covering the $100,000. could be partly covered by an increase in hook -on fees. We could give a part of these fees back to who ever fronts cost. Water treatment user fees for new hook -ups will be hand in hand with added treatment, and not available for use as part of repayment. We are looking for a source of funds for the increased size. The bottom line is that we cannot have a bottle neck at Hydraulic with a 24" line that won't carry the capacity that will be coming from the developments to the South. New developer to the North will face an even larger problem bringing their sewers to the Sanitary District, and at a higher cost. What we need is a more accurate picture of the numbers $$ - cost of 24" vs. 48 ". We need Joe to work on some rough figures for this. We can come up with some temporary solutions, but anything we do would be contingent on the new line on Hydraulic. Jeff - If we are at capacity should we allow anymore hook -ons? such as the 3 story for the Elderly? Mention was made of State programs, etc. All of which had already been explored and we are not eligible for a variety of reasons to include income average is to high. i We will not be able to offer any temporary line without the money commitment, cost for temp. would be $750. per unit for rt. 47 sewer, and then $1100. for the new sewer. That is the only way we can offer Doc Davis service. over and above all other costs. We are looking for creative alternatives here. Since Edmeier is not ready to make a commitment for funding, leaving Edmeier with no building season this year. A permanent solution has to be established before we can offer a temporary solution. It has to be part of the PUD agreement. Housing already approved will have service, and none will be shut off. Question to Developers - Where do they propose the waste go without this sewer? Studies are there, its just the funding that is missing. The city had no need to build a line until the developers came along. Now, there is a greater need. This situation needs to move forward, so we would like Mr. Roppolo to make his response, and then we can look forward from there. All issues will go to the EDC on the 17th. Assuming all favorable ...PUD wording. Ready before meeting. Adjournment I i