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Plan Commission Minutes 2005 10-12-05 Page 1 of 4 APPROVED 2/8/06 UNITED CITY OF YORKVILLE PLAN COMMISSION YORKVILLE CITY HALL COUNCIL CHAMBERS WEDNESDAY, OCTOBER 12,2005 Chairman Tom Lindblom called the meeting to order at 7 p.m. ROLL CALL Members present: Anne Lucietto, Sandra Adams, Michael Crouch, Charles Kraupner, Clarence Holdiman, Brian Schillinger, Bill Davis, and Tom Lindblom. Members absent: Jack Jones. A quorum was established. CITY STAFF AND VISITORS Mayor Art Prochaska; City Planner Mike Schoppe; City Attorney John Wyeth; and Aldermen Marty Munns and Rose Spears. Also see attached sign-in sheet. MINUTES Minutes from the May 11, 2005 meeting were approved. Lucietto made a motion to approve the minutes. Adams seconded the motion. The motion was unanimously approved by voice vote. Crouch made a motion to open public hearings. Kraupner seconded the motion. The motion was unanimously approved by voice vote. PUBLIC HEARINGS 1. PC 2005-32 JS&WD Development,LLC, Harry Anderson and William Galvin, petition to annex and rezone. See attached. 2. PC 2005-33 Wyndham Deerpoint Homes,JS&WD Development,LLC,Harry Anderson and William Galvin,Jr., petition to annex and rezone. See attached. Lucietto made a motion to close the public hearings. Crouch seconded the motion. The motion was unanimously approved by voice vote. OLD BUSINESS 1. PC 2005-43 Daniel A. Laniosz and Hinsbrook Bank Trust#03-008, petition to annex and rezone. According to the city's code official Bill Dettmer, the landowner needed to meet three requirements before he could meet city standards on the property. There had been some question at the previous meeting as to whether there were some outstanding Kendall County violations against Laniosz. Apparently those issues have been cleared. Attorney Dallas Ingemunson,representing the petitioner, said as long as Laniosz complies with the city's requirements, there shouldn't be a problem. I Page 2 of 4 William Garrett, who owns the neighboring property, said he opposes the planned redevelopment. He said he was promised that a 1-acre buffer between his property and the Laniosz property wouldn't be developed.Now Laniosz intends to build a nursery on it. Garrett said he's concerned about runoff onto his land with potential uses under B-3 zoning. He also said B-3 zoning is too broad of a zoning category. Likewise, he's concerned that B-3 zoning on the Laniosz property will devalue his own property. Lucietto made a motion to recommend annexation as requested in PC 2005-43. Crouch seconded the motion. The motion was unanimously approved by roll call vote. Lucietto, Adams, Holdiman, Kraupner, Crouch, Schillinger, Davis and Lindblom voted yes. As for the requested B-3 zoning, City Planner Mike Schoppe said a nursery is specifically identified under the B-3 zoning category. A nursery is not allowed under special use or in any other zoning category, he said. Lucietto said a motion to approve the zoning needs to be phrased so that it can only be used as a nursery in the event that the property were to be sold and someone would want it for another use. Schoppe suggested attaching a development agreement to the zoning. Mayor Art Prochaska said such an agreement would still make it viable for the property owner to run his business. But any changes to the business use would have to come back to the city for approval. Lucietto then moved to recommend rezoning for PC 2005-43 to B-3 with the restriction that a development agreement be drafted restricting use of the property for a nursery business only. The motion failed in a 4-3 vote with one abstention. Adams, Holdiman, Crouch and Schillinger voted no. Lucietto, Kraupner and Lindblom voted yes. Bill Davis abstained. OLD BUSINESS 1. PC 2005-32 JS & WD Development,LLC, Harry Anderson and William Galvin, Jr., petitioners, application to annex and rezone. At issue in this proposed development was the number of 10,000 square foot lots. There are about 76 of them in the proposed development. Rich Guerard, from Wyndham Deerpoint Homes, said they tried to compromise by placing the 10,000 square foot lots near open space. However, Lucietto said there are just too many of the 10,000-foot lots in the development. Guerard countered that this is as much open space as the city will likely see in a development. While the developers could increase the lots to 12,000 square feet, it would mean that some of the existing trees on the property and open space would be lost. The property consists of 178.3 acres and is located south of Route 71 and west of Legion Road. Guerard said the homes planned for all of the lots in the subdivision would be Page 3 of 4 comparable to homes in the surrounding area. He said plans are to build custom homes ranging in price from $600,000 to $1 million. So,the planned homes wouldn't negatively impact the neighboring property values. The Plan Commissioners also said there isn't enough access to the planned development. Crouch suggested an emergency access route to High Grove Road. Also, Guerard said because the developer is working under an annexation agreement,the development plans would be attached to the agreement. Schoppe added that the Plan Commission might want to include in its motion for approval that the developers meet the design objectives outlined in the city's south comprehensive plan. Schoppe also suggested the commissioners might want to make sure the city staff reviews the concept plan prior to approval. Lucietto made a motion to recommend annexation approval as requested in PC 2005-32. Crouch seconded the motion. The motion was unanimously approved in a roll call vote. Holdiman, Kraupner, Crouch, Schillinger, Davis, Lucietto, Adams and Lindblom voted yes. Lucietto moved to recommend zoning approval for PC 2005-32 subject to staff review of the concept plan and that the plans are consistent tow the design guidelines in the comprehensive plan. Kraupner seconded the motion. The motion was unanimously approved in a roll call vote. Kraupner, Crouch, Schillinger, Davis, Lucietto, Adams, Holdiman and Lindblom voted yes. 2. PC 2005-33 Wyndham Deerpoint Homes,JS&WD Development,LLC,Harry Anderson and William Galvin,Jr., petitioners, application to annex and rezone to R-2 One-Family Residence and B-2 General Business District. The property consists of 154 acres north of Route 71 and west of Pavilion Road. Davis asked Guerard what types of commercial businesses were planned. Guerard said he envisions neighborhood type uses such as a convenience store or a daycare center. He added the commercial development would come after the residential development. He said the developers would still have to come back to the city for a site plan. Crouch said while he realizes the plan has to return to the Plan Commission,he said he doesn't like the idea of traffic going through High View. He also said there are several issues that have to be addressed including archeological ones. Crouch made a motion to recommend annexation approval of PC 2005-33. Lucietto seconded the motion. The motion was unanimously approved in a roll call vote. Crouch, Schillinger, Davis, Lucietto, Adams, Holdiman, Kraupner and Lindblom voted yes. Lucietto made a motion to recommend zoning approval for PC 2005-33 as requested subject to staff review and conformance to design guidelines. Crouch seconded the Page 4 of 4 motion. The motion was approved in a 6-2 vote. Schillinger, Davis, Lucietto, Holdiman, Crouch and Lindblom voted yes. Adams and Kraupner voted no. Lucietto then made a motion to adjourn the meeting. Crouch seconded the motion. The motion was unanimously approved by voice vote. The meeting adjourned at 9:15 p.m. Minutes respectfully submitted by Dina Gipe PLAN COMMISSION MEETING UNITED CITY OF YORKVILLE , ILLINOIS REPORT OF PROCEEDINGS had at the meeting of the above-entitled matter taken before CHRISTINE M . VITOSH, C . S . R . , on October 12 , 2005 , at the hour of 7 : 00 p . m . , at 800 Game Farm Road, in the City of Yorkville , Illinois . REPO COURT reporting service 800 West Fifth Avenue • Suite 203C • Naperville, IL 60563 • 630-983-0030 • Fax 630-983-6013 www.depocourt.com r 2 1 P R E S E N T : 2 MR . TOM LINDBLOM, Chairman; 3 MR . CLARENCE HOLDIMAN; 4 MS . SANDRA ADAMS ; 5 MS . ANNE LUCIETTO; 6 MR . BILL DAVIS ; r 7 MR . CHARLES KRAUPPNER; 8 MR . MICHAEL CROUCH; 9 MR . BRIAN SCHILLINGER; 10 MR . MIKE SCHOPPE ; 11 MS . DINA GIPS . 12 A P P E A R A N C E S : . 13 WYETH, HEITZ & BROMBEREK 300 East Fifth Avenue , Suite 380 14 Naperville, Illinois 60563 ( 630 ) 355-1458 15 BY : MR . JOHN JUSTIN WYETH, appeared on behalf of the United 16 City of Yorkville , Illinois . 17 18 - - - - - 19 20 21 22 23 r 24 Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 3 1 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : At this time I 2 would entertain a motion to go to public hearing . 3 MR . CROUCH : Moved . 4 MR . KRAUPPNER : Second . 1 5 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Moved and 6 seconded to go to public hearing . Is there any 7 discussion on the motion? g (No Response ) 9 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Hearing none , 10 those in favor signify by age . 11 (A Chorus of Ayes ) 12 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Opposed? 13 (No Response ) I 14 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : We are now in 15 public hearing . 16 I would ask that any of you 17 that wish to address the Commission regarding 18 either one of these two public hearings please 19 stand, raise your right hand, and repeat after 20 me . 21 (Witnesses sworn) 22 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Thank you . The 23 first item is PC 2005-44 -- sorry, got the wrong 24 one . Is PC 2005-32 , JS & JW Development , LLC , Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 4 1 Harry Anderson and William Galvin, Jr . , 2 petitioners , have filed an application with the 3 United City of Yorkville , Kendall County, 4 Illinois , requesting annexation to the United 5 City of Yorkville and rezoning from Kendall 6 County A-1 Agricultural to United City of 7 Yorkville R-2 One-Family Residence District . 8 The real property consists of 9 approximately 178 . 3 acres south of Route 71 and 10 west of Legion Road, Kendall Township, Kendall 11 County, Illinois . 12 And who will be speaking on 13 behalf of the petitioners , Rich? 14 WHEREUPON : 15 RICHARD GUERARD, 16 having been first duly sworn, testified before 17 the Yorkville Plan Commission as follows : 18 MR . GUERARD : Yes . Good evening, 19 everyone . My name is Rich Guerard, Wyndham 20 Deerpoint . I am here on behalf of the 21 petitioners of the property . 22 As you stated, we petitioned 23 the city and we are requesting an R-2 zoning 24 under the city ' s ordinance and an annexation, and Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 5 1 it ' s a hearing for those two parcels . 2 If I can just quickly kind of 3 go over the property and give everybody a little 4 bit of background, I ' m sure everybody knows where 5 this piece is . 6 It ' s commonly known as the 7 Anderson farm, it ' s a portion of the property, 8 Route 71 to the north and then Highpoint here is 9 around to the south . 10 It ' s this portion of this 11 subdivision that we are naming Yorkwood Estates , 12 approximately 178 acres in size . What we are 13 requesting is all single-family homes . 14 There is three basic sizes of 15 single-family homes that you see here . These 16 lots that are shown right here in the lighter 17 green we ' re proposing as 10 , 000 square foot lots ; 18 the lots that are in the tan or light orange are 19 a minimum of 12 , 000 square feet ; and then the 20 brown on the darker to the south are a minimum of 21 half acre size lot . 22 The average size lot is above 23 those , but that ' s the minimum size lot in each 24 one of those categories . Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 6 1 The project has -- What our 2 intent as far as developing is is that these lots 3 will be on first move up -- first move up home 4 buyer price range . 5 These lots to the south, we 6 plan on putting the improvements in ourself and 7 basically selling a custom home , so this will be 8 a custom home subdivision located in the area . i 9 A few of the things -- We have 10 been through the concept process here , and some 11 of the changes were made as we went along, one of 12 the things that the city had an interest in is 13 they want a trail system that will go through the 14 property and ultimately connect to this property 15 to the north, which is another subdivision that 16 we are proposing, and then up through the 17 property, so there is a connected trail system to 18 the property . 19 We are approximately 47 percent 20 of the property between the detention and the 21 open space . We are developing about 53 percent 22 of the property, including the streets . 23 The density to it is 1 . 08 units 24 per acre , so the density of the project we are t Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 i 1 proposing is just over one unit per acre . 2 The project property is within 3 the ranges of the comprehensive plan . We will be 4 seeking, as we said, annexation into the city; it 5 would mean city sewer and water service to the 6 subdivision that we have been working with city 7 staff on, and I think that ' s pretty much a 8 summary of the subdivision . It ' s relatively 9 straightforward . 10 The only thing that would be a 11 possible -- possible exemption from the current 12 city ordinances is that these lots along this 13 open space that are 10 , 000 square foot minimum as 14 opposed to 12 , 000 , these darker lots right here 15 are all at least a minimum of 12 , 000 square feet , 16 so these are a minimum of 90-foot widths , these 17 are a minimum of 80-foot widths , and then the 18 custom home lots are a minimum of 120-foot lot 19 width, and basically the property has been 20 designed to work with both the topo there . 21 A couple of the things that the 22 city has asked before in other subdivisions that 23 we ' ve been through is to look at doing some 24 more -- You ' ll see none of these streets are very Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 8 1 straight , and that ' s potentially -- it ' s 2 curvilinear to really prevent any real tunneling 3 type of look there , so -- and there ' s also 4 significant topographics to the survey, so it ' s 5 going to add -- I mean, to the property, so it ' s 6 going to add quite a bit of character to these 7 subdivisions . 8 And I think with that , that ' s 9 pretty much a summary, and I would just open it 10 to questions and answer anything anybody might 11 have . Thank you . 12 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Okay . Before we 13 get into that from the audience , just for the 14 record, I ' d like to mention that we have received 15 a petition -- the title of it is a Petition 16 Opposing the Rezoning and Annexation of Chally 17 and Anderson Farms . All of us up here have 18 copies of this . 19 I ' m not going to read the whole 20 thing to you, but it ' s basically -- the 21 highlights of it is we , the undersigned residents 22 of Pavillion Heights and neighboring property 23 owners , oppose for the safety of children and 24 citizens , for flooding and run-off , for density, Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 9 1 for the quality of living, and this is signed by 2 90 people . 3 I have received another one 4 from Rainy Day Kennels , and is that Mr . Martino? 5 Is this the property you are concerned about? 6 MR . MARTINO : Yes . 7 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Yes . Okay . 8 Mr . Martino from Rainy Day Kennels has submitted 9 a statement that -- stating his reasons for 10 objecting to this . 11 They are obviously a kennel 12 raising dogs and have some concerns . I don ' t 13 believe you have this . 14 Due to the size of the audience 15 and the crowd, I would just ask you to bear with 16 me with one other thing . Once somebody stands 17 and raises an objection, let ' s just pick on one 18 item, let ' s just say water run-off . 19 Once that point has been made , 20 I don ' t want to hear 50 different people say 21 yeah, water run-off , yeah, water run-off, yeah, 22 water run-off . Once we ' ve heard it, we ' ve heard 23 it , we understand it ' s a concern . 24 We ' ve had previous meetings Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 10 1 where this has just escalated and it ' s gotten way 2 out of hand on a particular topic, so I would 3 just ask you to bear with us on that , and once we 4 hear that kind of objection, we understand that 5 it ' s for more than just one person . 6 Okay . With that being said 7 then, who would like to start this off? 8 Gentleman in the front row . 9 WHEREUPON : 10 BARRY SAUNDERS , 11 having been first duly sworn, testified before 12 the Yorkville Plan Commission as follows : 13 MR . SAUNDERS : Yes . My name is 14 Barry Saunders and I am a resident of the Maple 15 Grove subdivision . I ' ve got a number of issues 16 and concerns I would like to raise at this time . 17 The first one is the potential 18 safety of the -- safety analysis or the traffic 19 study that may include the joining of Anderson 20 with the Maple Grove subdivision . 21 That map does indicate that 22 that road looks like it ' s going to connect to 23 Long Grove Drive and, if that be the case , I 24 would like to know if there has been any kind of Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 11 1 traffic survey done . 2 I did an informal survey over 3 three days . Currently there are 27 houses in the 4 Maple Grove subdivision, and between 6 : 00 a .m. 5 and 6 : 00 p .m. , there were approximately 200 6 entrances and exits at Mapleridge and Legion -- 7 I ' m sorry, East Highpoint . 8 The eight houses on Long Grove 9 Drive , which is the road that we are talking 10 about that could connect to the Anderson farm, 11 between 6 : 00 a . m. and 6 : 00 p .m. , there were 30 12 going down that street turning onto Mapleridge 13 Court . That ' s a minimum of about four entries 14 per household . 15 Now, if you look at the map 16 that the gentleman put up here , the higher end 17 houses here , it ' s not going to take too long for 18 them to figure out that going through this to get 19 to 71 to go to 47 and 71 is going to take a lot 20 longer than cutting through this subdivision, and 21 there ' s potentially 50 houses here , so if you 22 take the average of what I took, of roughly 23 200 -- I mean, four per household times 50 , that 24 would be 200 extra ent -- potentially 200 extra Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 12 1 entries and exits onto Long Grove Drive and also 2 through the Maple Grove subdivision . 3 Secondly, the land at the end 4 of Long Grove Drive is probably at least I would 5 say ten to 12 feet higher than the existing land 6 at the Anderson farm. 7 The last survey that I saw by 8 the county of a floodplain was the 1982 Army 9 Corps of Engineers ' floodplain study . 10 Now, since that time there ' s 11 been at least two subdivisions that , as you say, 12 have water run-off going that way . 13 On both sides of Long Grove 14 Drive, there is 12 houses that empty into this 15 pond, which empties along this creek here , and 16 there are six houses , plus the houses over in 17 this subdivision that come in here , so this whole 18 area at the end of Long Grove Drive, and in this 19 specific area , if not a floodplain, would be at 20 least a wetlands , and I was wondering if the 21 Illinois Department of Natural Resources had been 22 contacted to see what kind of impact that may 23 have on their way of doing business with regards 24 to the water run-off . Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 13 1 The third issue -- and this is 2 probably an issue that ' s strictly for the people 3 on Long Grove Drive -- is that the number of cars 4 going down there could possibly decrease the home 5 values . 6 Right now it ' s a dead-end 7 street , it ' s quiet , tree-lined, and if you put 8 that road through, it ' s going to become I believe 9 a major thoroughfare going through there . 10 I do have a solution, though . 11 I do have a solution . Always come with a 12 solution . Always comes with a solution . 13 Instead, right over here , 14 Brighton Oaks II is going to be going in, and 15 Brighton Oaks II needs a road to make sure that ' s 16 not landlocked, so if you just simply, that ' s -- 17 and I think it would be cost effective for you, 18 rather than razing all this or putting a bridge 19 or whatever you are going to do to handle all the 20 water that comes down here , if you were to take 21 this and run it this way to Brighton Oaks II , 22 that would solve Brighton Oaks II ' s problem and 23 could solve your problem as not landlocking the 24 subdivision . Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 14 1 I guess I am hoping that one , 2 all of you probably wouldn ' t want to see an 3 increase of 200 cars coming down your block every 4 day, potentially, and, secondly, I would hope 5 that county, city, township officials would take 6 into consideration the people that are there 7 already rather than those that are moving in, who 8 know no other way . 9 We have established, have moved 10 into that subdivision in order to set up what we 11 think is a really nice subdivision, and to 12 increase that traffic flow with safety and all 13 that stuff that ' s concerned with that , we feel 14 it ' s probably not the best interests of the 15 residents of Maple Grove subdivision . 16 So can I have your vote on 17 thinking about that anyway? 18 MR . GUERARD : Yes . What I ' ll do is 19 I ' ll wait until everybody talks , but , yes , we are 20 going to be looking at it . 21 MR . SAUNDERS : Okay . Thank you . 22 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Okay . Thank 23 you, Mr . Saunders . 24 Anybody else on this petition? Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 15 1 Yes , sir, back of the room. 2 WHEREUPON : 3 CHARLES CLARK, 4 having been first duly sworn, testified before 5 the Yorkville Plan Commission as follows : 6 MR . CLARK : I am Charles Clark, 7 resident of Maple Grove , resident on Long Grove 8 Drive . 9 I ' m not going to take a long 10 time , but I do want to emphasize that the reason 11 we moved out to that subdivision only just 12 recently was the fact that it does dead-end on 13 Long Grove Drive . 14 And there are several kids out 15 there , including my own . There is not a sidewalk 16 system out there , so there is a lot of bicycle 17 traffic on the streets through the subdivision . 18 We felt like that was a safe 19 area for our kids , even though there aren ' t 20 sidewalks , we know there isn ' t a lot of through 21 traffic through there , and that was one of the 22 reasons , one of the main reasons , why we chose 23 that subdivision to move to . 24 So my primary concern is the Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 16 1 safety of the kids that play in that subdivision, 2 along with what Mr . Saunders said . 3 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Okay . Thank 4 you . Somebody else? Yes , ma ' am. 5 WHEREUPON : 6 SUZANNE HETZEL, 7 having been first duly sworn, testified before 8 the Yorkville Plan Commission as follows : 9 MS . HETZEL : My name is Suzanne 10 Hetzel and I also live on Long Grove Drive , and I 11 guess my major concern is environmental . 12 Currently where the larger 13 homes are right now is a beautiful , wooded area 14 with animals , I don ' t know if service is the 15 right word, but this area is a nature area with 16 deer, barred owls , all sorts of different 17 wildlife that services really four different 18 subdivisions . 19 Four different subdivisions 20 benefit from the nature area in this particular 21 lower area there , and I have grave concerns about 22 what ' s going to happen to the environment, to the 23 animals , to the general ambience of the area 24 should this be completely wiped out . Thank you . Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 17 1 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Okay . Thank 2 you . Gentleman in the doorway, please . 3 WHEREUPON : 4 JOHN SHERRY, 5 having been first duly sworn, testified before 6 the Yorkville Plan Commission as follows : 7 MR . SHERRY : Thank you, 8 Mr . Chairperson . My name is John Sherry, 9 S-H-E-R-R-Y . I live at 87 Long Grove Road, Long 10 Drove Drive . 11 And I have a question for you, 12 Mr . Chairperson, and your colleagues , as well as 13 the developers . 14 My question is this : Where is 15 the water going to go? I don ' t mean to be 16 redundant , Mr . Chairman, about your point about 17 the water run-off . 18 If I may explain, in the 19 property to my left , to your right , my home 20 borders on the new development , and I own 3 . 22 21 acres at the end of Maple Grove development . 22 Approximately one-half mile or 23 more before my property, the land contours down 24 into like a V . When it rains , the water runs Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 18 1 down to the vortex of the V and then proceeds 2 down through my property . 3 There is a creek on my 4 property . We built a bridge across it . The 5 bridge is 12 feet long . When it rains , the water 6 is anywhere from six inches to 14 inches deep, 7 and it runs downward . I don ' t know if you can 8 see it , Mr . Chairperson, and your colleagues . 9 It runs downward into the 10 property that ' s being developed right where the 11 proposed road would go through, meaning Long 12 Drove Road, Long Grove Drive . 13 UNIDENTIFIED AUDIENCE MEMBER : 14 ( inaudible ) . 15 MR . SHERRY : I ' m sorry, I couldn ' t 16 hear you . What did you say? 17 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Please , I don ' t 18 want that going on for the court reporter . 19 You ' ve got the floor . Let ' s leave it at that . 20 MR . SHERRY : Thank you, 21 Mr . Chairperson . Where the proposed road would 22 go in -- and I understand -- I apologize , I ' ve 23 forgotten your name , sir . 24 MR . GUERARD : Rich . Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 19 1 MR . SHERRY : Rich . Thank you . Rich 2 or Richard made the presentation . It ' s proposed 3 that the road go through . 4 Once again, my question is , 5 without being redundant or trite , where is the 6 water going to go? Thank you, Mr . Chairperson . 7 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Do we have 8 anybody else that cares to speak on this issue? 9 Yes , sir . 10 WHEREUPON : 11 RICK MARTINO, 12 having been first duly sworn, testified before 13 the Yorkville Plan Commission as follows : 14 MR . MARTINO : Thank you for this 15 opportunity to speak . I am representing Rainy 16 Day Kennel . 17 You have my concerns in 18 writing . Most of the concerns have been 19 addressed, except for the heavy equipment that ' s 20 going to be used in this construction and the 21 congestion on Route 71 . 22 The other concern I have , which 23 is my own, is that they ' re going to be right up 24 against my fence line with heavy duty equipment , Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 20 1 fumes , dust, vapors , and I have a concern for my 2 animals . 3 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Was your point 4 about the construction equipment in your -- 5 MR . MARTINO : Construction equipment 6 working along my fence line . 7 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Okay . 8 MR . MARTINO : And there has to be 9 some way to secure it . 10 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Okay . We have 11 this in the record . 12 MR . MARTINO : Yes . The other point, 13 which was just barely touched on, was the lowland 14 wildlife preserve as someone put it, okay? 15 I have pictures -- and I have 16 been watching this -- there ' s a population of 17 about 60 whitetail deer down there , there is 18 endangered water fowl , whooping cranes , geese , 19 ducks , great horned owls , barn owls , turkey, 20 vultures , and it is a hunting ground for the red 21 tail and American eagles , this far east of 22 Starved Rock . 23 Everything else as far as 24 water and everything else has been basically Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 21 1 addressed . 2 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Mr . Martino, 3 just for the record, is your property the 4 property directly to the -- as we are looking at 5 the map, to the left? 6 MR . MARTINO : South . 7 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : The light 8 colored area? Could you point? 9 MR . MARTINO : I am -- 10 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Look up a little 11 higher , please . Up on 71 ? 12 MR . MARTINO : Right here . 13 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Okay . I thought 14 that to be the case , but I just wanted to verify . 15 Thank you . 16 MR . MARTINO : Yes . 17 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Is there anybody 18 else then on this petition? I see a hand towards 19 the back of the room. 20 WHEREUPON : 21 KEN VOGT, 22 having been first duly sworn, testified before 23 the Yorkville Plan Commission as follows : 24 MR . VOGT : Thank you . I am Ken Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 22 1 Vogt . I would like to ask you a question . I own 2 30 acres , which is -- I own all this right here 3 all the way to right here , and these are all 4 trees and this is my pasture land and my house is 5 here , okay? 6 I can ' t see any of this 30 7 acres . What my question is is how are you going 8 to keep the people off my field since I can ' t see 9 it all? And you are going to landlock me, 10 because this is all subdivision around me , you ' re 11 going to landlock me . And I own most of the 12 wetlands and the wooded area, and there is a lot 13 of oaks and stuff here . I would just like to 14 know how you are going to control for one, the 15 people getting on my land, and -- 16 because with the bike path going along here , it 17 would be nothing to get out and tear up the 18 fields , since you are going to landlock me . And 19 that ' s my question . 20 MR . SCHILLINGER : Is your land zoned 21 ag? 22 MR . VOGT : Yes . And I ' ll be right 23 in the middle of it , so it ' s like , you know, if 24 I -- you know, I have horses , and if I have wild Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 23 1 animals back there , I can ' t -- I can ' t see the 2 entire property, so I ' ll have a real tough time 3 managing it, especially with a bike path and 4 everything . 5 And between -- and I own a lot 6 of the wetlands right here , which is -- this is 7 all wetlands , and between here , where he ' s 8 wanting to put the pond, this is pasture field 9 and this side is wetlands . 10 I ' m afraid if he doesn ' t do the 11 pond right , he ' s going to turn all mine into 12 wetlands because I do have some acreage there 13 that is tillable . 14 Because there is -- there is 15 20 -- 23 acres there and about eight of it, 16 approximately eight of it is pasture , the rest of 17 it is wetlands , and there is -- what the other 18 people said, there is a lot of animals and stuff . 19 But I ' m wondering how they will 20 control the people from getting -- you know, if 21 you run a bike path down the property line like 22 that , what ' s going to keep them -- especially if 23 you landlock me like that . 24 MR . SCHILLINGER : Can you show me on Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 24 1 my map which home is yours? 2 MR . VOGT : I don ' t actually -- 3 MR . SCHILLINGER : It ' s the same map . 4 MR . VOGT : All right . Can I mark on 5 yours? 6 MR . SCHILLINGER : Yeah, go for it . 7 Actually, if you want , I can show you a survey . 8 MR . VOGT : And when it rains , there 9 is this running ( inaudible ) . 10 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Okay . Let ' s not 11 have this side conversation . Show it on the map . 12 MR . VOGT : Sorry . I was just 13 drawing it out . Okay? Thank you . 14 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Let ' s just let 15 the court reporter show that the -- it was just 16 indicated on the map of Brian ' s where that was . 17 I don ' t want that conversation taking place . 18 Anybody else then? 19 (No response ) 20 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Would the rest 21 of -- Rich, do you care to address any of these 22 right now or -- 23 MR . GUERARD : Yes , let me address a 24 few of the things . Part of the immediate -- The Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 25 1 purpose of this hearing really is with the 2 annexation and the zoning we are asking for . 3 One thing that they are not 4 reviewing yet , haven ' t reviewed yet , is the 5 engineering, so particularly issues like 6 stormwater is something that hasn ' t been reviewed 7 yet , and there will be another -- you know, 8 assuming we get by this process , there will be a 9 whole other process for preliminary engineering 10 and another process on our final . 11 Just in general regarding the 12 stormwater , you know, we will be requiring -- we 13 will be conforming with all of -- the county has 14 their own stormwater requirements and ordinances , 15 the city has some that are even more restrictive 16 than those on how the stormwater is handled, but 17 in general , we can ' t -- we are required to 18 contain any of the water that comes onto our site 19 and we are not allowed to drain off onto somebody 20 else ' s site , and we have a stormwater system 21 that ' s designed to handle the stormwater . 22 You know, this doesn ' t have a 23 stormwater system because it was built before -- 24 well , actually it has some retention ponds , but Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 26 1 this will be a pretty significant stormwater 2 system, and this -- in 20 years of doing this , 3 I ' ve never had a subdivision that didn ' t 4 significantly improve the drainage in the area as 5 opposed to make it worse . The ordinances are 6 designed to do that . So this will be engineered . 7 Kind of another offshoot of 8 that has to do with this -- this entrance right 9 here has been discussed . 10 This hasn ' t been an entrance 11 that the city has said right now that they want 12 or that they require . 13 This is part of our concept 14 plan that we proposed and presented, and this -- 15 under the concept plan, normally just -- it ' s 16 considered a matter of good planning to make 17 connections , so we have made this connection and 18 connecting it . 19 Ultimately whether that will be 20 connected or not is not a decision that ' s being 21 addressed really by the Planning Commission 22 tonight , it ' s another part of another process 23 that we are going to go through, but certainly 24 that ' s something that everybody will be looking Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 27 1 at . 2 So I think principally another 3 issue having to do with, you know, what ' s 4 happening around it or protection of the area, 5 certainly we will work with the homeowners , you 6 know, whether -- for protection, whether it ' s 7 fencing, whether it ' s landscaping, whether it ' s 8 something else . 9 One concern we would have is 10 there is significant trees around here, and to 11 the extent possible, we are trying to leave as 12 many of them as we can, so we don ' t want to take 13 trees down to put a fence up unless we have to , 14 but we will work with people who are around us 15 that might -- you ' ll see -- we ' re trying to do 16 that right now, but we certainly would be happy 17 to meet with anybody initially, with your 18 engineers , our engineers , your consultants , ours , 19 however you want to do it , and try to accommodate 20 everyone as much as possible . 21 So having said that , thank you 22 very much, and we would be happy to answer any 23 other questions anyone might have . 24 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Okay . John Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 28 1 Whitehouse , could I call on you to -- if you have 2 any comments , not specifically on this project , 3 but more on the whole issue of retaining 4 stormwater? And I am doing this just for the 5 benefit of the audience . 6 John Whitehouse is a consulting 7 engineer for the city, and maybe you could say a 8 few words , John, and I don ' t mean to put you on 9 the spot , but -- 10 MR . WHITEHOUSE : Well , you can ' t do 11 that , but just to reiterate what Rich said, is 12 that it is always a concern when new subdivisions 13 abut existing subdivisions , as well as existing 14 agricultural fields , because there is just as 15 much a problem not only with existing run-off, as 16 Mr . Sherry described coming through his lot onto 17 his property and the fact that that not be 18 blocked, you ' d have to let that water continue 19 through your subdivision, as well as not let your 20 water leave your subdivision and inundate 21 somebody else ' s property . 22 The city has very strict 23 requirements for stormwater . Sound engineering 24 practice and Illinois drainage law stipulate Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 29 1 everything that has to be done , and I agree with 2 Rich, in my 25 years of experience in this 3 business is you always improve over the existing 4 condition . 5 I ' ll admit that it seems 6 strange that we never have a hundred year flood 7 until after a new subdivision comes in right next 8 door to your house , but all the systems in new 9 subdivisions are designed to handle that and to 10 negate or minimize any additional run-off or 11 existing run-off that goes onto existing 12 properties , so it is handled very much in detail , 13 not at concept, but the stormwater report , the 14 wetland study, the DNR reviews for archeological 15 and endangered species resources that happen, all 16 of those things that are required before a 17 preliminary plan approval can have significant 18 impact on a concept plan, and the con -- and the 19 preliminary plan that gets approved could be 20 completely different than what ' s proposed here 21 once all those studies have been completed . 22 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Okay . Thank 23 you, John . Mike , anything else to add to that? 24 MR . SCHOPPE : No, not regarding Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 30 1 stormwater . 2 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Okay . 3 Mr . Saunders , you had your hand up . 4 MR . SAUNDERS : Just one last point 5 I ' d like to make with regards -- since this might 6 not be your charge in the road, I would 7 appreciate any notes you may have , any 8 recommendations you may have for the next board 9 that may look at the roads because that is a 10 major problem for all of us in the Maple Grove 11 subdivision . 12 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Okay . Thank 13 you . Any other comments on this petition? 14 (No Response ) 15 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Okay . Hearing 16 none , I will then move on to PC 2005-33 , Wyndham 17 Deerpoint Homes , JS & JW Development , LLC, Harry 18 Anderson and William Galvin, Jr . , petitioners , 19 have filed an application with the United City of 20 Yorkville , Kendall County, Illinois , requesting 21 annexation to the United City of Yorkville and 22 rezoning from Kendall County, A-1 , Agricultural 23 to the United City of Yorkville B-2 General 24 Business District and R-2 One-Family Residence Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 31 1 District . 2 The real property consists of 3 approximately 154 acres north of Route 71 and 4 west of Pavillion Road, Kendall Township, Kendall 5 County, Illinois . 6 Rich , are you going to go 7 again? 8 MR . GUERARD : Yes . Good evening, 9 everyone . I know you know who I am, but , for the 10 record, it ' s Rich Guerard appearing on behalf of 11 the petitioners and owners of the property . 12 In this case we are the owners 13 of the property in addition to petitioners , and 14 we are -- once again, we are proposing a -- this 15 is a single-family subdivision . It is a PUD that 16 we are requesting . It would be an R-2 zoning 17 with also the -- a B-2 business use at this 18 corner . 19 The property -- once again, I ' m 20 sure everyone is familiar with it -- it ' s 21 directly north of this -- of the previous 22 Anderson farm . 23 This is Route 71 . This is 24 Pavillion Road that runs up across it . The total Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 32 1 acreage of the property is approximately 154 2 acres , and we are proposing 234 single-family 3 lots . 4 Although all the lots are R-2 , 5 they are all conforming R-2 lots , we have mixed 6 up the sizes of the lots to have a little 7 different way on the product . 8 Just to give you an idea, these 9 lots along here -- make sure I ' ve got the right 10 ones -- are a minimum of 12 , 000 square foot lots . 11 These are also a minimum of 12 12 , 000 square foot lots , these have a minimum of 13 90-foot frontage , these have a minimum of 80-foot 14 frontage . 15 The lots here along the 16 existing Pavillion Heights subdivision are larger 17 lots . Those lots are -- They are a minimum 18 number of 18 , 000 square feet , but they are 90 and 19 they have a minimum number depth of 200 square 20 feet -- I ' m sorry, 200 feet in depth to allow a 21 greater depth between an existing subdivision and 22 the homes that are there now . 23 We have been through the -- 24 actually been through the concept process twice Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 33 1 on this subdivision and made some changes through 2 the process . 3 Once again, similar to what I 4 talked to you before , the preliminary engineering 5 and all the stormwater studies and everything are 6 not -- have not been completed and submitted to 7 the city yet for review . 8 Some of the proposals , the park 9 was interested in having a park over here with 10 the potential of a possible school site to the 11 west , so the park has been designed in that area . 12 We are talking about this being 13 a dry detention area , maybe extend the park . 14 Once again, there is a lot of curvilinear streets 15 that have been built into the property . It also 16 has a trail system. 17 You can ' t see this trail system 18 very well , but once proposed, it ' s going to start 19 connecting up with the Yorkwood Estates trail 20 system and basically come up all the way up 21 through the property, once again going to the 22 proposed subdivision to the north of the 23 property . 24 The gross density is Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 34 1 approximately 1 . 5 , 1 . 52 . Once again, it ' s within 2 the range of the comprehensive plan, and it ' s a 3 straightforward subdivision . 4 As I said, we ' ve met with the 5 park district . There is another park site that ' s 6 going to be in this location . 7 The reason for the somewhat 8 unusual shape there is there is existing tree 9 rows on there that we are trying to save , and 10 there is some high and dry in the middle , so 11 that ' s going to be dedicated to the park system 12 and we ' ll get a partial credit for that 13 contribution . 14 I believe , once again, I have 15 pretty much given a summary of the property . I ' d 16 be happy to answer any other questions anybody 17 has regarding that . Thank you . 18 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Okay . Thank 19 you . And who would like to go first on this 20 issue? 21 MR . SCOTT : I guess I will . 22 WHEREUPON : 23 RANDY SCOTT, 24 having been first duly sworn, testified before Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 35 1 the Yorkville Plan Commission as follows : 2 MR . SCOTT : My name is Randy Scott . 3 I live at 45 Highview Drive . I can show you my 4 house here . It ' s right up here in the corner 5 just around the curve there . 6 I have many concerns , and I 7 don ' t want to steal anybody ' s glory . I don ' t 8 want to waste a lot of time here either . 9 You all have the petition in 10 front of you . Some of the other people here may 11 speak about this . 12 I think I ' ve got half my 13 neighbors here, and there is 90 some signatures . 14 I think just about everybody is here that borders 15 that property . 16 Many concerns . First off is 17 lot size , and, of course , the other issue is 18 roads . 19 The one thing I ' d like to point 20 out , I have noticed on the plan here also that we 21 have a road that ' s going to continue through 22 here , that is a low area also, and I know we 23 don ' t want to keep talking about flooding, but 24 with that in mind -- Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 36 1 I don ' t know how I should do 2 this , if you want to pass these around . 3 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Put them up, 4 Randy, right in front of the one that ' s there , 5 and I think everybody can see it if you point out 6 what it is you are trying to show . 7 MR . SCOTT : These pictures here -- 8 and I ' ll leave these with you folks if you want 9 to study them or whatever you want to do . 10 These pictures here depict this 11 area down here between Highview and Hillside 12 Drive . I don ' t know if the neighbor that ' s here , 13 this lady -- You can see the water -- there he 14 is , okay . These are from his pictures . 15 You can see the water going 16 down the storm sewer here , you can see the boat 17 out here . 18 The whole -- there is a creek 19 that runs through there, and it ' s right along 20 here , and our concern is -- I know that you are 21 talking about drainage and we don ' t want to be 22 redundant . 23 Our question is again where 24 will the water go? You ' ve these retention areas ; Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 37 1 I know they have to drain out at some point in 2 time , but this is very low here, and our 3 subdivision was never designed with drainage, and 4 so we have constant flooding problems . 5 I can point out to you, we ' ve 6 got water coming out of the field here . Here is 7 where your road ' s going to come through and it ' s 8 going to cross here and intersect here . This is 9 Highview coming down this way, going up this way 10 to this man ' s house here . There ' s that . 11 We can explain -- I don ' t 12 know -- I don ' t want to take a lot of time, but I 13 can explain to you -- 14 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Mike , Mike 15 Crouch, could you grab that maybe -- Are you 16 through addressing those pictures , Randy? 17 MR . SCOTT : For right now . 18 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Could you go and 19 maybe pass them around so we get a closer look at 20 them? 21 MR . SCOTT : Sure . I want to show 22 you where the water originated next , if I may . 23 First of all , this is my house . 24 Two times -- I have lived there Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 38 1 since May of 1992 , and two times I ' ve had to 2 contour my land because of water run-off , and I 3 just wanted you to be able to see , we ' ve got the 4 excavation equipment , we ' ve got a road grader and 5 skid steer here digging this , and all the work 6 that it ' s gone through to put this in . 7 This is what we have to do when 8 there is problems and it ' s not done properly, 9 okay? 10 I think eventually we all pay 11 as taxpayers . May 13th, 2004 we had water coming 12 down the hill . It blew out my basement window . 13 There was water in my basement . The water had 14 receded here because we spent all the time 15 cleaning it up . It was up to the bottom of my 16 siding . I was like in a moat . 17 Water completely engulfed -- I8 I ' ve got a couple neighbors here who saw that , 19 completely engulfed it . You can see the water 20 coming down . It ran over across the top of my 21 other two neighbors ' driveways here . 22 Goes down here, goes down 23 through my neighbor ' s yard here , goes down 24 through this fellow ' s yard -- he ' s got pictures , Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 39 1 too -- goes right on down there to the end . 2 What did I do with the other 3 pictures? Did I leave some pictures over there? 4 There is some more that I ' ll submit to you of the 5 back of the yard . I don ' t know what I did with 6 them right now . Apologize . But that ' s a 7 concern . 8 Just a couple other quick 9 comments . We are concerned about lot size as 10 well . We all have one-acre lots . 11 The streets will not handle any 12 traffic . The comment I want to make here was if 13 you go up in this area here , people are going to 14 want to take the shortcut , I know I always do . 15 They are going to be coming through here . 16 Our streets are not designed to 17 handle this amount of traffic . I ' m sure these 18 streets will be wider than ours , two cars can 19 pass , that ' s about it, so we are concerned once 20 again about the safety of our children, flooding . 21 You ' ve got the petition, you 22 can read that . You can take this and pass it 23 around . If you can hang on to these . 24 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Randy, did you Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 40 1 say that all of the lots in your subdivision are 2 one-acre lots ? 3 MR . SCOTT : Some of them are larger . 4 Some of them are up to two acres , all at least 5 45 , 000 square feet because of the well and 6 septic . 7 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Let me rephrase 8 that . Minimum of one-acre lots ; is that correct? 9 MR . SCOTT : Some have two acres . 10 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Minimum. 11 MR . SCOTT : Minimum an acre . 12 MR . GUERARD : Thank you . 13 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Okay . Is there 14 somebody else that wishes to address this? Yes , 15 sir . 16 WHEREUPON : 17 KEN HETZEL, 18 having been first duly sworn, testified before 19 the Yorkville Plan Commission as follows : 20 MR . HETZEL : It ' s Ken Hetzel , 71 21 Long Grove . And I guess I am more connected with 22 the prior discussion, but my question is not 23 where the water is going to go, but where the 24 developer expects the water to come from. Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 41 1 I think the request was for 2 village water and sewer . That ' s not shown . The 3 easements to get the sewer and water out there 4 are not shown, and one would wonder with the 5 sprinkler ban on the summer if the city really 6 has those resources to offer prior to an 7 annexation . So those are my concerns . 8 Does the city have the resource 9 available to offer a developer prior to annexing 10 it in? 11 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Okay . Thank 12 you . Somebody else? Going once . You are on . 13 WHEREUPON : 14 KURT KLOSS , 15 having been first duly sworn, testified before 16 the Yorkville Plan Commission as follows : 17 MR . KLOSS : My name is Kurt Kloss . 18 I live at the end of 10 Highview Drive . The new 19 proposal will be bordering my property . 20 I want to bring to your 21 attention to the fact that there were two early 22 settlements that were right on the site of the 23 Chally property . 24 There was the community of Long Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 42 1 Grove in the early 1800 ' s , and that was bordered 2 by the community of Pavillion, which was a 3 booming town . It had a drugstore , it had a 4 saddle shop, a school . It was even considered at 5 one time to be a candidate for the county seat . 6 The main drag of Pavillion, the 7 main road, was known as the Hartz Gravel Road . 8 It ran for at least a half a mile and it crossed 9 the Chicago-to-Ottawa Road, which was of 10 tremendous historical value . 11 We aren ' t really sure of the 12 location of the Chicago-to-Ottawa Road . It was 13 somewhere near Route 71 , but it hasn ' t been 14 determined exactly . 15 Several other locations have 16 been . The original school , which was known as 17 the Brick Academy or the Pavillion Academy, was 18 the largest secondary school in northern 19 Illinois , including Chicago, for quite some time . 20 The location of the church is 21 known, the blacksmith shop, and, of course, the 22 cemetery . 23 I wanted to mention, especially 24 to you, Mr . Wyeth, the State of Illinois Historic Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 43 1 Resources Preservation Act , which states -- well , 2 I won ' t read the whole thing -- but as early in 3 the planning process as possible and before 4 anything is determined that there must be a study 5 done , a historical impact study, of any sites of 6 historical value . 7 Now, this is normally used to 8 determine if a particular site , if a house or a 9 building, is of historical value . In this case, 10 we are dealing about an entire community . 11 In all fairness , it ' s also 12 included in the Act that the director -- the 13 director has to be notified within 30 days 14 before -- I mean, 30 days of when this is first 15 proposed . 16 The director will not require 17 an excavation in all cases , though, unless there 18 is at least, you know, one site of particular 19 historical value , and on the Chally property, 20 there is at least one foundation that ' s still -- 21 still exists . 22 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Mr . Kloss , do 23 you have any idea in general where some of these 24 things are at in relationship to -- Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 44 1 MR . KLOSS : Yes . 2 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Could you maybe 3 point that out for our information? 4 MR . KLOSS : The community of Long 5 Grove was -- it was just exactly what it says , it 6 was a grove of trees , and it pretty much -- from 7 Legion Road, it pretty much took on this area 8 right around here . 9 There was a scattering of log 10 houses around there , which most of them are I ' m 11 sure long gone, but that is where the early 12 settlers of Kendall County, many of them, settled 13 right on the border of Long Grove . 14 The town of Pavillion was a 15 much more structured community, and it centered 16 pretty much on Legion Road and the intersection 17 of the Chicago-to-Ottawa Road, which was near 71 . 18 Now, the Hartz Gravel Road, 19 which was the main business district of 20 Pavillion, was approximately a half a mile long . 21 We aren ' t absolutely sure how far that half mile 22 extended into this property . 23 We do know that right near the 24 commercial area here that ' s proposed, that was Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 45 1 the site of a church . 2 Right here was the blacksmith 3 shop, the school is farther south on Legion Road, 4 but we don ' t know how far this extended into this 5 proposal here . 6 The foundation that I mentioned 7 will be right here , right where the road is 8 proposed . 9 Now, I have lived in the 10 Yorkville area -- I moved here almost 50 years 11 ago . There ' s never been a road or a driveway or 12 anything going in to that foundation, so I can ' t 13 help assume that it ' s been there a whole lot 14 longer than I have . 15 So, anyway, I think at this 16 point , maybe some of this should be left up to 17 the discretion of the director . 18 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Yes , sir . Where 19 do you live in relationship -- 20 MR . KLOSS : I live right on the end 21 of Highview Drive . Right there ( indicating ) . 22 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Okay . Thank 23 you . Thank you . 24 MR . KLOSS : Thank you for your time . Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 46 1 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Other comments? 2 Yes , sir . 3 WHEREUPON : 4 NICK KETTINGER, 5 having been first duly sworn, testified before 6 the Yorkville Plan Commission as follows : 7 MR . KETTINGER : My name is Nick 8 Kettinger and I live in Pavillion Heights , and my 9 concerns -- I guess it would be concerns -- deal 10 with the actual annexation of the property and 11 being able to service the property, the 12 anticipated population . 13 With annexation of the 14 property, does that include improvement to the 15 roads , the county roads , and the state highway, 16 particularly Fox Road, Route 71 , Pavillion Road, 17 even Highpoint . 18 And the utilities , which has 19 been already expressed, the water particularly, 20 is there going to be -- going to have to be a 21 water tower out there -- where will that be , will 22 we take into consideration, will the city take 23 into consideration, early on traffic control , 24 traffic lights? Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 47 1 Even at this stage traffic to 2 get onto 71 in the morning is hectic, and I 3 anticipate that ' s only going to get worse and 4 worse as new subdivisions open . 5 Will that -- Will that all be 6 handled as part of the annexation? Certainly 7 hope that you will be looking to all of these 8 things . Thank you . 9 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Thank you . Yes , 10 sir . 11 WHEREUPON : 12 JEFF GORDON, 13 having been first duly sworn, testified before 14 the Yorkville Plan Commission as follows : 15 MR . GORDON : My name is Jeff Gordon 16 and I live on 11429 State Route 71 , which is 17 right here , and my two concerns are the view 18 that ' s out here to the west and the commercial 19 acreage there , would be to the east of us . 20 And everybody knows that you 21 put commercial property or business property next 22 to a residential house, which is zoned 23 agriculture right now, and the value of that . 24 And the other thing is the view Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 48 1 out the back . We ' ve lived there for 20 years , 2 and it ' s a concern of mine , is the view . 3 If you put even a single-story 4 house back there , you ' ve lost our summer sunset . 5 And the business area that ' s in 6 that corner, I don ' t know what ' s proposed for it , 7 but you put up Gas City or, you know, Shell , or 8 whatever have you right there , it ' s a major 9 concern of mine , those two -- those two issues , 10 for us . Thank you . 11 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Okay . Thank 12 you . Randy? 13 MR . SCOTT : May I ask one more 14 question? 15 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Sure . 16 MR . SCOTT : I didn ' t hear this . 17 This is proposed for annexation to the city and 18 zoning . That ' s what we are here for . 19 My question is if, and, or when 20 this gets annexed, my question -- I don ' t know if 21 somebody can answer it , I don ' t know -- when you 22 put this into the city, do not the other 23 properties -- Does it have to go adjoining? Can 24 they skip over properties ? What ' s the procedure? Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 49 1 That ' s my question . 2 MR . WYETH : They have to be 3 contiguous , which means there has to be a 4 touching point, but it can be irregular shapes , 5 where those others , just from observation, might 6 look like they have been skipped over, but there 7 has to be a connected point . The word is 8 contiguity . 9 MR . SCOTT : Do we know if there is 10 others that are contiguous to this property? 11 Mr . WYETH : The one directly to the 12 north, there is a property that ' s being 13 considered by the city . 14 MR . SCOTT : This one? 15 MR . WYETH : Yes . 16 MR . SCOTT : Okay . Thank you . 17 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Other questions 18 or concerns? I see a hand in the back . 19 WHEREUPON : 20 MOLA RAFIEI , 21 having been first duly sworn, testified before 22 the Yorkville Plan Commission as follows : 23 MR . RAFIEI : My first name is Mola , 24 last name , Rafiei , and it ' s spelled R-A-F-I-E-I , Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 50 1 and I have a question for Richard and the city 2 engineer . 3 You mentioned that the new 4 subdivision always improved the water -- improved 5 the flooding, always . But could it have an 6 adverse effect? 7 MR . WHITEHOUSE : On the volume of 8 run-off? 9 MR . RAFIEI : Exactly, to the next 10 property . 11 MR . WHITEHOUSE : Not if done 12 properly . 13 MR . RAFIEI : I ' m sorry? 14 MR . WHITEHOUSE : Not if done 15 properly . 16 MR . RAFIEI : Well , could it be done 17 improperly? 18 MR . WHITEHOUSE : It ' s our intent 19 that they not be improperly -- 20 MR . RAFIEI : But it could happen? 21 MR . WHITEHOUSE : I doubt it . 22 MR . RAFIEI : Why do you doubt it? 23 MR . WHITEHOUSE : Because of the 24 review process that it ' s going through . Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 51 1 MR . RAFIEI : By your city engineer , 2 correct? 3 MR . WHITEHOUSE : Yes . 4 MR . RAFIEI : Well , I am too, okay? 5 And believe it could have an adverse effect . 6 MR . WHITEHOUSE : Anything is 7 possible , but the process we go through with the 8 city ' s requirements , the intent is they do that . 9 MR . RAFIEI : Okay . Have you done 10 any study regarding Pavillion Heights regarding 11 soil condition? 12 MR . WHITEHOUSE : Not yet . 13 MR . RAFIEI : Did you know that we 14 have a very high water -- 15 MR . WHITEHOUSE : Table? 16 MR . RAFIEI : Yeah, water . Exactly . 17 Correct . 18 MR . WHITEHOUSE : I would assume you 19 probably do . 20 MR. RAFIEI : Do you know that most 21 of the houses in this area, in Pavillion Heights , 22 their sump pump runs all the time , in the winter 23 time , in the summer time , even when it ' s dry? I 24 think you have a problem. That ' s it . Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 52 1 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Okay . Thank 2 you . Anybody else with any other questions or 3 concerns? Yes , sir . 4 WHEREUPON : 5 RALPH MARR, 6 having been first duly sworn, testified before 7 the Yorkville Plan Commission as follows : 8 MR . MARR: My name is Ralph Marr . I 9 am a resident of Pavillion Heights also, 79 . One 10 of the things Randy was talking about , in the 11 connection here , one of the other gentlemen 12 mentioned there are no sidewalks through here , 13 and that ' s also true for Pavillion Heights . They 14 are narrow roads and there is no place for our 15 children to play . 16 And the other thing I am 17 concerned with is the access to Route 71 . That ' s 18 over a hill right there . 19 And are there any limitations 20 on a major thoroughfare like that, how many 21 intersections there can be? 22 That ' s a pretty congested area 23 and people clip along pretty good there . Thank 24 you . Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 53 1 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Okay . Thank 2 you . Anybody else? 3 WHEREUPON : 4 NEIL SULLIVAN, 5 having been first duly sworn, testified before 6 the Yorkville Plan Commission as follows : 7 MR . SULLIVAN : My name is Neil 8 Sullivan . I live at Pavillion Heights . I am a 9 police officer for 33 years , and I am a watch 10 commander , and I have to deal with every day with 11 traffic problems , people cutting through 12 subdivisions . 13 As I am looking at these areas 14 here , some of these have tried to touch on this . 15 The area there at Pavillion and Route 71 , when I 16 moved here 13 years ago, I used to be able to get 17 out -- I work for Lisle . Used to be able to get 18 out immediately onto 71 . 19 There is so much traffic coming 20 from the west now that it takes quite a long time 21 to get out . 22 My concern is is that not only 23 the cut-through traffic from the new subdivision 24 into the existing, but you put up a development Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 54 1 there for retail , unless there is a stoplight put 2 in there -- and I know the state and the county 3 and the village are very reluctant to put up 4 stoplights for a lot of different reasons , one is 5 the cost impact , okay -- I think we ' re going to 6 have a major problem. 7 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Okay . Thank 8 you . Other concerns? 9 Rich, do you care to address 10 those? 11 MR . GUERARD : Just a couple things , 12 and I will be brief in light of what everyone ' s 13 already said . 14 Again, this connection right 15 here , we did that . That ' s our idea . That ' s not 16 something the city has decided on yet or told us 17 that they want . 18 There is a connection to the 19 west and a connection to the north in addition to 20 the other ones , so that will be something that 21 when the city has an opportunity to review our 22 studies and soil tests and everything else we 23 have , they will make their recommendations and 24 look at that . Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 55 1 On the water, we also were 2 contacted I believe right through here, owners 3 that had several issues similar to problems , what 4 you just showed with your pictures with the 5 flooding there . 6 Mainly I would say one obvious 7 thing is the fact we didn ' t have anything to do 8 with that flooding because the flooding is 9 already existing because it doesn ' t have the 10 stormwater controls to it , and while we may not 11 solve that problem 100 percent , we are going to 12 dramatically improve that stormwater issue and 13 the problem that ' s there by the design of all 14 this interconnected stormwater system that ' s 15 going to be holding and managing the water . 16 So believe it or not , it ' s the 17 reality . That ' s the truth . You can talk to any 18 stormwater engineer . This will dramatically 19 improve that situation . And, once again, that ' s 20 going to be taken into consideration as this 21 design is being done . 22 And I think, you know, as it ' s 23 been pointed out by the Chairman of the Planning 24 Commission, or actually by the city engineer, Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 56 1 this plan could still change significantly based 2 on the stormwater studies and things that are 3 done . 4 And one thing to say, the 5 gentleman was correct about an archeological 6 study that ' s done for this property and 7 historical work, and this isn ' t the time where 8 that ' s presented and reviewed, that ' s another 9 stage in the process , but it is a stage in the 10 process that has to be approved before it goes to 11 the next level, and this is property that ' s 12 proposed to be served by sewer and water by the 13 city, and, once again, all that ' s part of the 14 engineering or design and could be part of the 15 process as we go through it . 16 And it can ' t be annexed until 17 it ' s contiguous , so this is something -- we are 18 starting the process now, but this isn ' t 19 something that happens tomorrow, it ' s something 20 that happens over a period of time . 21 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Yes , sir . 22 MR . SULLIVAN : One of the concerns I 23 have here is most of us , because of the water 24 quality of our wells , have water conditioners , Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 57 1 and if the city force annexed us into that , we 2 are going to have to cap off our wells . 3 There is a lot of impact that ' s 4 going to happen to us , and I have seen this in 5 the village that I work in, okay, so my question 6 is what -- and I know you probably can ' t answer, 7 but once we are contiguous on three sides and 8 know we ' re going to -- the City of Yorkville has 9 the right to force annex us -- 10 MR . GUERARD : To my knowledge , the 11 City of Yorkville has never force annexed anyone . 12 MAYOR PROCHASKA : There are holes 13 all over Yorkville , and I can ' t guarantee that 14 that will never happen, but , historically, the 15 City of Yorkville -- in fact , if you go just to 16 the north side of this property, there is two 17 blocks of unincorporated land that have been 18 unincorporated for 30 , 40 years , and the city has 19 not had a history of force annexing any of the 20 residential areas . 21 There is several large parcels 22 throughout the city where they are simply 23 surrounded and they ' re there . 24 Now, if you should -- If the Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 58 1 people there should decide that they would like 2 to have the city services , they would definitely 3 be requested to annex if they want to have city 4 services . If they want to stay on well and 5 septic, that ' s their choice . 6 MR . SULLIVAN : If there is an 7 annexation and you are supplying water there, 8 then I believe everybody has to hook up . Is that 9 not true? 10 MAYOR PROCHASKA : No . We ' ve done 11 this all around town . I ' m telling you . You can 12 go out right here -- 13 MR . SCHILLINGER : Ace Hardware . Ace 14 Hardware . 15 MAYOR PROCHASKA : Go out to -- Ace 16 Hardware is not the -- 17 MR . SCHILLINGER : All four sides . 18 MAYOR PROCHASKA : Ace Hardware is 19 not , Prairie that surrounds the Wacker 20 subdivision, which is one-acre lots , well and 21 septic, to this day they are well and septic . 22 On the south side, if you go 23 out to where Wildwood is out there off of 71 -- 24 or off of 126 , there is an area of Crooked Creek Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 59 1 in there that is surrounded by the city, but is 2 still unincorporated . They are still on well and 3 septic . 4 Again, if you ' re going to ask 5 can I guarantee , me sitting here today, I ' m only 6 going to be here for however long, but 7 historically the city has not made an effort to 8 annex residential properties into the city . 9 And actually, up along 10 Cannonball Trail you have the same issue . That 11 area is completely surrounded by the city . So 12 that ' s all I can tell you . 13 MR . MARR : So what was the purpose 14 of including Pavillion Heights into this 15 annexation proposal? 16 MR . GUERARD : It ' s not . 17 MAYOR PROCHASKA : It ' s not . You are 18 notified because you live within -- The city 19 requires , and actually the state -- the city 20 requires it more than the state does , that 21 residents within a certain distance of any 22 development in the city have to be notified so 23 you are aware of what goes on, so you can be 24 aware of what goes on and give your comments , and Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 60 1 that ' s why we do this . 2 Actually, the subdivision of 3 Pavillion Heights is not included in their 4 proposal at all . It ' s the property to the west 5 of it there , west and south . 6 MR . MARR : I see . I must have 7 misunderstood the letter . I thought it said 8 everything west of Pavillion Road over to -- 9 MR . GUERARD : The description might 10 have been a little vague , but that ' s the area . 11 Sir, you had your hand up . 12 UNIDENTIFIED AUDIENCE MEMBER : On 13 the diagram, the blue , are those retention ponds ? 14 MR . GUERARD : They are retention 15 ponds . There is one thing -- there is two things 16 about it; one is it ' s not necessarily wet . It ' s 17 showing it , but they could be dry . 18 The other issue is they could 19 change with engineering . This is real rough with 20 the topo . But the size of them and exact 21 location of them may change . 22 UNIDENTIFIED AUDIENCE MEMBER : And 23 what ' s the acreage to be taken up by the 24 retention pond in proportion to the subdivision Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 61 1 roughly? 2 MR . GUERARD : I can give you a rule 3 of thumb . It ' s usually between 15 and 17 4 percent . I don ' t know exactly what it is here , 5 and what ' s -- Even if I knew what is here, that ' s 6 not likely to be what it is when it ' s done 7 because the detailed engineering hasn ' t been, you 8 know, accomplished yet . Yes , ma ' am. 9 WHEREUPON : 10 CHERYL WATTS , 11 having been first duly sworn, testified before 12 the Yorkville Plan Commission as follows : 13 MS . WATTS : I was just wondering, 14 you had some custom home lots . You have none in 15 this subdivision? 16 MR . GUERARD : When I say -- Well , 17 these are 12 , 000 square foot lots , so the homes 18 that would be built on there , they could be 19 custom or they could not be custom . 20 I mean, they ' re going to be 21 homes that aren ' t -- These are not production 22 level , entry level homes on these size lots , but 23 there is a difference in lot size . 24 The others are half acre , these Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 62 1 are 12 , 000 , so I would expect the half acre lots 2 will have bigger, more custom homes on them. 3 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : I ' m going to ask 4 you, if you wish to be recognized, raise your 5 hand, be recognized by me so we can get your name 6 in the record, ask Mr . Guerard your question and 7 he can respond to it . Okay? Those are the 8 rules . 9 MR . DAVIS : Can we have your name? 10 MS . WATTS : Cheryl Watts , and I live 11 at 1255 Pavillion . 12 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : I have a lady in 13 the back of the room. Would you come forward, 14 state your name, and ask your question? 15 WHEREUPON : 16 SHERRY SCHWINGLE , 17 having been first duly sworn, testified before 18 the Yorkville Plan Commission as follows : 19 MS . SCHWINGLE : Sherry Schwingle , 10 20 Hillside Drive . 21 When you say it doesn ' t involve 22 Pavillion Heights , if you make a street through, 23 that will go through the subdivision, a new 24 subdivision, it will involve us , correct? Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 63 1 MR . GUERARD : I ' m sorry, I didn ' t 2 say not involve . He was just commenting this was 3 not being annexed into the city . 4 If this connection went through 5 here , there would be traffic through there . 6 MS . SCHWINGLE : We are not a native 7 to Yorkville , we moved in a year ago . We bought 8 in this subdivision because it ' s a quiet , small 9 subdivision . 10 We came from Naperville, which 11 is very busy, a lot of traffic . That ' s one of 12 the reasons we bought in this subdivision . 13 And now if you look, our 14 property backs up here . We ' ll have four -- three 15 to four homes to look at out of the back of our 16 property, and I know at some point the cornfield 17 was probably going to be developed, but I didn ' t 18 expect to see four homes . 19 So I hope you take into 20 consideration the people that have lived in the 21 subdivision for quite a while before deciding to 22 approve this . Thank you . 23 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Okay . Thank 24 you . I had a gentleman over here . Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 64 1 WHEREUPON : 2 BOB CARGELLI , 3 having been first duly sworn, testified before 4 the Yorkville Plan Commission as follows : 5 MR . CARGELLI : My name is Bob 6 Cargelli . I live at 2 Hillside Drive . And my 7 question to you is we have all acre and more, I 8 have almost two acres , and why is this the 9 density you are putting behind our homes ? Why 10 are you packing in so many lots into this 11 subdivision? 12 MR . GUERARD : If that ' s a question 13 to me, I can answer from our viewpoint . One 14 thing -- They are two different things . 15 This is a well and septic 16 subdivision that you have to have a minimum of an 17 acre , and a significant portion of. this is your 18 separation, and obviously your septic system and 19 well system. That is sewer and water system. 20 There is significantly more 21 expense involved with putting in the 22 infrastructure with the detention areas here . 23 We tried to respect your 24 properties here by doing it with larger lots and Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 65 1 deeper lots , and the plan is to put a landscape 2 preservation area across the back of the 3 property, but these still won ' t be the same size 4 as yours . 5 They are larger -- I think they 6 are a minimum of 18 , 000 square foot lots ; a lot 7 of them are larger than 18 , 000 square foot lots . 8 So they aren ' t as large as 9 yours , but they are lots designed for homes that 10 are basically comparable, these type of homes . 11 MR . CARGELLI : But we have all these 12 homes that we built ourselves , and we bought this 13 land for that purpose , and all of a sudden you 14 come in and you jam in -- this is my opinion -- 15 as many lots as you can cram into that area , even 16 though you ' re going to try to cosmetic it behind 17 our homes , and I think the board should realize 18 what we have out there , what you people have . 19 The village of Yorkville is 20 very unique . Don ' t ruin it . That ' s all I have 21 to say . 22 (Applause ) 23 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : For 24 clarification for the audience , could I call on Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 66 1 Mike or John to maybe explain what steps this is 2 going to have to go through from here on, knowing 3 full well , as was explained by Mr . Guerard, that 4 this plan that you see may change , will change , 5 before anything is final , but can you go through 6 some of the steps so people know what that is ? 7 MR . SCHOPPE : Sure . I think 8 somebody mentioned it earlier, perhaps it was on 9 the earlier public hearing, that the request 10 tonight only involves two of the three important 11 steps . 12 The three important steps are 13 first they annex the property, second is to zone 14 the property, and third is to approve the 15 development plans . 16 Only those first two items are 17 being requested tonight , with the annexation and 18 the zoning . 19 So after the property would be 20 zoned to the city, they would be required to 21 submit preliminary plats , preliminary 22 engineering, and then that process evolved into 23 final engineering and final plats . 24 As part of that , there is a Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 67 1 whole bureaucratic review process that involves 2 the city -- in this case it involves the city, 3 the county, the state , in terms of the state 4 roads , and even probably some federal 5 jurisdiction if there is some wetlands and other 6 environmental areas . 7 So there -- Even if this were 8 to go through and be rezoned, I can -- not 9 guarantee , but I am very confident that there 10 would need to be changes made to the plan just 11 because of the review process and the other 12 issues that are going to be surfaced as the 13 project would go through that review process . 14 And that ' s generally -- Once those final plans 15 are approved, then, of course, it does need to 16 become contiguous , and I don ' t believe those 17 plans would be -- there would be final approval 18 until the contiguity is , in fact , there . 19 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Do you have 20 anything to add? 21 MR . WYETH : I ' d add that as 22 developments come to the city, almost without 23 exception, they are the subject of an annexation 24 agreement , which also requires an additional Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 68 1 public hearing conducted pretty much exactly like 2 this one that ' s here tonight . 3 The annexation agreement is 4 more or less a contract between the land owner 5 and developer and the city as to certain aspects 6 of what is -- of what the developer will look 7 like within limitations of zoning and required 8 laws , as well as sometimes some specific things 9 that may be unique to that particular property, 10 so there would be another public hearing that 11 would take place . 12 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Okay . Let me 13 ask again, is there any other comments or is 14 there any questions about procedures as to where 15 we may go after tonight? 16 Randy, you had your hand up . 17 MR . SCOTT : Procedure question . 18 When it goes through this process that these 19 fellas just mentioned, will we again be given an 20 opportunity to come and make comments ? 21 MR . WYETH : At the public hearing 22 that I just mentioned, you would be allowed to 23 make comments , yes . 24 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Yes , ma ' am. Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 69 1 MS . WATTS : Is there a web site or 2 something we can go to, or how will we know when 3 the next meeting is ? 4 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : I don ' t 5 believe -- 6 MR . WYETH : The city has a web site , 7 you may want to look for that . I ' m not good at 8 memorizing web site names , but I think if you 9 just search for the City of Yorkville home page 10 that will -- I1 MAYOR PROCHASKA : It ' s Yorkville -- 12 MR . WYETH : dot IL dot US ? 13 MAYOR PROCHASKA : -- dot IL dot US . 14 And the agendas are generally posted on the web 15 site . If not , you are always welcome to call the 16 city . All agendas have to be posted 48 hours 17 prior to any meeting, and you are welcome to come 18 get those . 19 UNIDENTIFIED AUDIENCE MEMBER : And 20 the newspaper may have . 21 MAYOR PROCHASKA : Sometimes they do . 22 Sometimes they don ' t put them in the newspaper . 23 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Even if there is 24 not a public hearing per se , this meeting itself Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 70 1 is a public meeting and you are welcome to attend 2 that , and that ' s the agenda that will be posted 3 48 hours in advance . 4 MR . CROUCH : All meetings are public 5 meetings . 6 MAYOR PROCHASKA : As Mr . Crouch just 7 said, all meetings are public meetings . When 8 things move out of this Commission, they then go 9 to the city ' s Economic Development Committee, 10 which is a committee of the City Council . 11 Their next meeting would be 12 next Thursday -- a week from tomorrow is when 13 it ' s scheduled . 14 From there , that group then 15 makes a recommendation to the City Council ' s 16 Committee of the Whole , where it is discussed at 17 length, and then it goes on to the City Council , 18 so there is a number of meetings that it will go 19 through yet . 20 Now, I don ' t know if it will 21 just go in right in a row or not . Odds are -- We 22 do have to have -- An annexation agreement has to 23 be created, a PUD has to be created, so there is 24 some paperwork that needs to be done , but Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 71 1 definitely I would check for the meeting next 2 Thursday to see if it is going to be on the 3 agenda at that committee . That would be a good 4 start . Okay? 5 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Okay . Anything 6 else before I ask to close the public hearing? 7 John? 8 MR . WHITEHOUSE : Just real quickly 9 on traffic, because that was a concern, is a 10 traffic study is required as part of those 11 preliminary development plans before the 12 annexation agreement , and the city does -- has 13 consistently required of all new developments a 14 minimum of $2 , 000 per housing unit transportation 15 impact fee that would be applied to local 16 transportation improvements in the vicinity of 17 the subdivision, so that could very well , as long 18 as it was warranted by the state standards , 19 include signalization at Pavillion and 71 . 20 MAYOR PROCHASKA : John, this is 21 included in the area that the EI is doing for the 22 overall traffic -- 23 MR . WHITEHOUSE : Yes , the Fox Road 24 area traffic study looked at this area, including Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 72 1 Pavillion Road as far as traffic -- trip 2 generations , and the developer would be required 3 to supplement that traffic study with his 4 internal traffic counts and the direction of the 5 traffic based on the proposed connections and 6 entrances and the -- ultimately the Pavillion and 7 71 intersection will warrant signals , and the 8 state is very reluctant to spend their money 9 before they -- before they need to or before 10 there is unfortunately accidents at those 11 locations . 12 But if it is warranted by the 13 state standards , the city will see that it ' s done 14 as part of an annexation agreement . 15 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Yes , sir . Over 16 here . Your name? 17 MR . MARR : One question to anyone . 18 How is this property going to abut the future 19 prairie parkway that was published in the 20 newspaper? 21 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : I don ' t know 22 the -- 23 MAYOR PROCHASKA : I think the 24 prairie parkway is still to the west because I Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 73 1 think the proposed route is actually west of 2 Highpoint Road . 3 MS . LUCIETTO : Yes . 4 MAYOR PROCHASKA : Yes , it ' s 5 substantially west . I don ' t know if it ' s 6 substantially, but maybe a mile west or so . 7 MR . MARR : When we ' re building a 8 subdivision like this -- 9 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Excuse me . 10 Could I have your name again? 11 MR . MARR : My name is Ralph Marr . 12 Does anybody keep in mind how many entrances we 13 are making to Route 71 ? 14 I hate to bring this up again, 15 but on that stretch right there , there ' s got to 16 be half dozen in a thousand feet , two entrances 17 to a subdivision right here on a 55 mile an hour 18 road within seven houses there . 19 MR . WHITEHOUSE : Any access to 20 Route 71 is subject to state permit, okay? 21 So just -- Even if the city said it ' s okay, it ' s 22 not okay . It ' s subject to the state requirements 23 for separation . 24 They evaluate based on the Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 74 1 state safety criteria and their minimum -- 2 minimum or maximum distance between accesses , 3 they look at existing points of access and try to 4 match them up as much as they can, and these two 5 that are proposed here down on the southwesterly 6 section, down in this area here -- 7 MR . MARR : Right . 8 MR . WHITEHOUSE : -- those -- In my 9 opinion, one of those would be approved by the 10 state, but it ' s still up to them. 11 MR . MARR : And then the other one 12 going down into the other section there adjoining 13 that one would be adjacent to it I am presuming . 14 MR . WHITEHOUSE : Yeah . Once in the 15 other previous concept plan that was up there, 16 those are both set up to match these , but it ' s 17 going to be the state ' s call as to whether or not 18 either one of those is permitted, and they may 19 say well , no, you don ' t get either one of those 20 in those locations , you may get one in the middle 21 of the location . 22 They are set up that way 23 because of the high grade there . This whole line 24 right there, everything that ' s a big wide Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 75 1 right-of-way right there , and it would be 2 difficult to put an entrance there , so what the 3 state decides is going to be based on their 4 criteria , but it ' s completely their call . 5 MR . MARR : Do they intend to keep a 6 road like Route 71 free of a stoplight every 7 couple of blocks or whatever so we are going to 8 end up like Naperville? 9 MR . WHITEHOUSE : That is probably 10 the state ' s intent , but, again, that ' s up to 11 them . 12 MR . MARR : Thank you . 13 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : At this point I 14 would ask for a motion to close the public 15 hearing . 16 MS . LUCIETTO : So moved . 17 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Second? 18 MR . CROUCH : Second . 19 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Moved and 20 seconded to close the public hearing . Is there 21 discussion on the motion? 22 (No response ) 23 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Hearing none, 24 those in favor signify by saying aye . Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 76 1 (A Chorus of Ayes ) 2 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Opposed? 3 (No Response ) 4 CHAIRMAN LINDBLOM : Motion passes . 5 (Which were all the 6 proceedings had in 7 the public hearing 8 portion of the 9 meeting . ) 10 ---000--- 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 Depo Court Reporting Service ( 630 ) 983-0030 77 1 STATE OF ILLINOIS ) ss : 2 COUNTY OF LASALLE ) 3 4 CHRISTINE M . VITOSH, being first duly 5 sworn, on oath says that she is a Certified 6 Shorthand Reporter doing business in the State of 7 Illinois ; 8 That she reported in shorthand the 9 proceedings had at the foregoing public hearing; 10 And that the foregoing is a true and 11 correct transcript of her shorthand notes so 12 taken as aforesaid and contains all the 13 proceedings had at the said public hearing . 14 IN WITNESS WHEREOF I have hereunto set 15 my hand this jTtIL day of 16 �C� / ` , 2005 . 17 18 19 ` CHRISTINE M . VITO H, C . . 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27:16,22 34:16 37:10,23 43:8 47:22 48:4 Hardware[4] 58:13,14 household[2] 11:14,23 entrance[31 26:8,10 75:2 Farms[11 8:17 Galvin[21 4:1 30:18 58:16,18 houses[1o1 11:3,8,17,21 entrances[41 11:6 72:6 farther[11 45:3 Game[11 1:9 Harry[21 4:1 30:17 12:14,16,16 44:10 51:21 Depo Court Reporting Service Index Page 3 Naperville, Illinois (630) 983-0030 Plan Commission Multi-Page housing -needs October 12, 2005 73:18 irregular[il 49:4 40:3 64:24 65:5,7 looks[1i 10:22 mention[2] 8:14 42:23 housing[1] 71:14 issue[ioi 13:1,2 19:8 largest[11 42:18 lost[1] 48:4 mentioned[6] 45:6 50:3 hundred[11 29:6 27:3 28:3 34:20 35:17 LASALLE[11 77:2 lots[34l 5:16,17,18 6:2,5 52:12 66:8 68:19,22 bunting[11 20:20 55:12 59:10 60:18 last[31 12:7 30:4 49:24 7:12,14,18 32:3,4,5,6,9 met[11 34:4 issues[s1 10:15 25:5 48:9 law[1i 28:24 32:10,12,15,17,17 39:10 MICHAEL[11 2:8 _ 55:3 67:12 40:1,2,8 58:20 61:14,17 middle[31 22:23 34:10 -I item[21 3:23 9:18 laws[1l 68:8 61:22 62:1 64:10,24 65:1 74:20 idea(31 32:8 43:23 54:15 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