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Plan Commission Minutes 2004 05-12-04 Page 1 of 6 UNITED CITY OF YORKVILLE Approved PLAN COMMISSION MEETING 06/09/04 YORKVILLE CITY HALL COUNCIL CHAMBERS WEDNESDAY, MAY 12, 2004 Deputy Chairman Anne Lucietto called the meeting to order at 7:02 p.m. ROLL CALL Members present: Andrew Kubala, Brian Schillinger, Bill Davis and Clarence Holdiman. No quorum was established; Deputy Chairman Lucietto stated that there was no action to be taken this evening and asked the presenters to proceed. Members Michael Crouch arrived 7:04 and Kerry Green arrived 7:20. VISITORS Mayor Art Prochaska; Alderman Richard Sticka; City Attorney Kelly Kramer; City Planner Mike Schoppe; Lynn Dubajic from the Yorkville Economic Development Corporation; and John Whitehouse, Engineering Enterprises, Inc. Also, see attached sign- in sheet. MINUTES None PUBLIC HEARINGS None PRESENTATIONS Land Use Plan for Regional Stormwater Management for Galena Road & Route 47 Planning Area City Planner Mike Schoppe reported that, due to developer's interest in the area, City Administrator Graff requesting that he prepare a conceptual regional storm water land use plan for the area east of Route 47 from Corneils Road to Route 30. Some things that need to be taken into consideration when developing the land use are: • There have been meetings between Fox Metro and Yorkville-Bristol Sanitary District (YBSD)to discuss how this area will be serviced. • There is water infrastructure being built in the area. • Engineering Enterprises, Inc. (EEI)has done a floodplain study of Rob Roy Creek which investigated a tributary going into the creek called the Raymond Drainage They found this tributary has significant floodplain issues. He stated that the purpose of the presentation was to bring the Commission up to date with research being done to update the Comprehensive Plan and begin discussions on how to approach certain issues in the area. Page 2 of 6 He turned the floor over to Mr. Whitehouse who explained the floodplain issues in the area: • Raymond Drainage is a tributary area of approximately 1300-1400 acres of land south of Route 30 and east of Route 47 that contributes stormwater to the Rob Roy Creek. • Originally, the Raymond Drainage was not included in the Rob Roy Creek Floodplain Study because it was thought to flow into the Blackberry Creek. Upon further investigation, it was found to flow into the Rob Roy Creek. • Anytime a tributary area is greater than a square mile and contributes to a floodplain, the floodway needs to be identified. • Over 180 acres has been identified which holds water up to 3' at its deepest before it spills over and carries over to the Caledonia area and then to the Rob Roy Creek. • This area presents development problems such poor soil, depressional water storage and stormwater detention. Mr. Whitehouse went over maps which exhibited the conceptual development plans for the area. He explained that the depressional area to the south could be excavated to a depth of five to seven feet along with a new piped outlet to the Rob Roy Creek would provide approximately 1,350 acre-feet of stormwater storage. This would provide stormwater detention plus depressional storage for the whole area. All the developments in the area could send their stormwater to this area; there would be no need for individual detention basins. Conveyance channels would route the water to the detention area. He reiterated that this is a conceptual plan and is not based on any development or concept plans for the area. Mr. Schoppe stated that the study area(Route 30 on the north, Corneils Road on the south, Dickson Road to the east and Route 47 on the west) is approximately 1620 acres with 225 acres of commercial use. Based on the current Comprehensive Plan, the remaining acreage is projected to hold 3,400 homes at a density of 2.6 units/acre. Mr. Schoppe explained that there are two issues the City needs to consider when amending to Comprehensive Plan: 1. Maintain the same amount of commercial area as currently planned. 2. Maintain the same unit count(3,400 units)to support the commercial with less land to work with due to the storm water management. He proposed two options: 1. Additional density to maintain the same unit count 2. Providing density bonuses within developments in trade for receiving additional high and dry open space beyond that which is required. Mr. Whitehouse noted that typically in residential development 10%of land is set aside to storm water management purposes. He stated that the overall acreage of the site is Page 3 of 6 1,620 so it would be expected to set aside 162 acres. The large green area south of Galena Road is 185 acres. This green area along with those set aside for conveyance channels and swales brings the total area to approximately 275 acres. This is in access of the typical area for storm water management and there is 120 acres less land for development. Mr. Schoppe and Mr. Whitehouse asked the Commission for their input. Brian Schillinger noted that even though there is 120 acres less to develop, a developer has more developable acreage to work with because they do not have to put detention areas in. Andrew Kubala questioned why the same numbers of units should be maintained. He objected to this because the depressional area is a natural phenomenon and this area should be deducted out and the original Comprehensive Plan maintained. Mr. Schoppe, Mr. Whitehouse and Mr. Kubala further discussed the balance between residential and commercial areas and the existing Comprehensive Plan. Bill Davis asked what the reduction of commercial property would be. Mr. Schoppe stated that he had not calculated this but estimated that it could be 10% less. There was further discussion on the conveyance channels and the storage area. Mr. Whitehouse further explained the concept: o The channel would be similar to a bio-swale. o It will convey water and have detention capabilities however it would be more of a wetland area. o There will be overflow weirs which will gradually control water flow in the case of an extreme storm. o The storage area will hold the runoff from a 100-year storm. o The design will hold all the water from the north and east of the area or everything in the Raymond Watershed. Mike Crouch noted that the plan stops north of Corneils Road and he asked if there was any other areas affected by the floodplain or wetlands extending to the railroad tracks. Mr. Whitehouse stated that the area south of Corneils Road is in the Blackberry Creek Watershed and he explained how the proposed plan helps out the Blackberry Creek floodplain. Mr. Crouch clarified that the commercial would be diminished because there will not be enough residents to support it. Mr. Schoppe stated that this is the assumption however at this time here are no statistics to support it; further research is needed. Mr. Crouch stated that he felt it was hard to accept this assumption. Mr. Davis asked Mayor Prochaska asked what the reasoning was behind maintaining density as it related to commercial property. Mayor Prochaska stated that the United City of Yorkville is in competition with other communities for attracting commercial Page 4 of 6 properties because commercial developers look at unit count to support the commercial area. Lynn Dubajic, Executive Director of the Yorkville Economic Development Corporation, stated that commercial developers also look at the demographics of the surrounding area of a property before they develop. Mr. Schillinger commented that while he understood the concept of keeping the same amount of addresses and population in the area to attract commercial he felt that larger lot sizes larger gave a certain character to the town. He stated that he felt commercial will still come to the area even with fewer homes. Mayor Prochaska stated that according to the Comprehensive Plan, the transition areas cannot ask for more density without giving the City something in return such as more usable open space. Anne Lucietto stated that addressing the density was hard without available statistics. She suggested that Mr. Schoppe do some further research and bring back some concrete numbers to the Planning Commission so they could give direction. Mr. Crouch commented that he liked the idea of a regional storm water management but agreed more information was needed before density was addressed. The Planning Commission discussed the second question posed to them; should the City pursue providing density bonuses within developments in trade for receiving additional high and dry open space beyond that which is required. Mr. Schoppe explained that there will be open space around the water storage area. It has been suggested that the City could acquire an additional 50— 150 acres of open space around the site that could be used for a community recreation feature. In exchange for the additional land, the City could consider trading a density "bonus"with the landowners. There was further discussion on this question including the change in density, cost of land, potential uses for a larger parcel of land, etc. Mr. Kubala and Mr. Green stated that they liked the idea of a trade for increased density for increased open space. Mr. Crouch agreed however noted that each case has its own merit. Mr. Davis commented that he would like to see the overall density remain as it is, with no change to the Comprehensive Plan, but agreed to allow developer's to trade for open space. Mr. Schoppe clarified that the majority of the Commission felt that trading additional units for open space was acceptable however the units/acre, location, etc. should be considered before making the trade. The Commission agreed. There was further discussion on the number of units as it relates to the commercial area. Mr. Schoppe indicated that he would work with Mrs. Dubajic to investigate the statistics related to this and bring this information back to the Commission. Page 5 of 6 Mr. Whitehouse commented that there are a lot of"smart growth" seminars going on which discuss if a population should be concentrated in one area with high design standards versus spreading the population over as much land as possible. He noted that units on smaller lots with more open space means less roads, sewers, watermains, streetlights, etc. for the City to maintain. The City is better off in this situation with regards to long term maintenance. There was no further discussion. Blackberry Creek Alternative Futures Project Ksenia Rudensiuk of the Conservation Foundation addressed the Commission. She shared the following data with the Commission: • The Blackberry Creek begins in Elburn, Illinois and joins the Fox River in Yorkville. • The area has progressed from prairie to agricultural to urban development and as the population increases in the area, a degradation of streams is seen. • In this area of the country, rain water infiltrates the water table through wetlands which filters the water that feeds local creeks. • In a predevelopment system, some water evaporates and some slowly feeds creeks. After an area develops, creeks are fed by surface runoff causing pollution, erosion, etc. • It is importance to maintaining creek quality for wildlife, and flooding. • The use of native prairie grass with long root structure retards runoff, channels and filters water to the water table, etc. Ms. Rudensiuk explained that the Blackberry Creek Alternative Future Analysis Study took municipal comprehensive plans for the watershed area and through the use of computer modeling investigated the impact of the build out of the area on water quality. The study looked at conventional(storm sewers, dense pavement, etc)and conservation methods (wetlands, prairie grass, porous pavement, etc.)to water management along with flooding and water quality information. She explained that the conservation method maps creeks and rivers, flood plains, wetlands and hydrous soils and then the land use is developed around this information. She stated that the study looked at once-a-year rain event discharge rate,the required detention volume and the TQ mean(the portion of time the flow is greater than average). Ms. Rudensiuk stated that the study took 40 acre parcels and compared conventional methods to conservation methods. She showed slides demonstrating the application of both methods with regards to: o Stream Corridors o Wetlands • Commercial—parking lots, retention areas, etc. • Moderate Denisity—Residential o Rural/Estate—Residential Page 6 of 6 It was determined that the increase of conventional methods of storm water management would increase runoff and flooding whereas the conservation method decreases this. She also noted that the study did not address the clustering of buildings as Mr. Whitehouse suggested earlier however clustering provides even better results than those indicated in the study. There are benefits to clustering such as improving the environment, lowering flooding and lowering infrastructure costs. She stated that Aurora is a community who is implementing conservation principals with developers in the Blackberry Creek Watershed. She stated that their comprehensive plan has more details such as creeks, wetlands, hydrous soils, flood plains, etc. and developers submit plans using this plan. Ms. Rudensiuk also distributed various handouts regarding conservation design and guidelines for local ordinances. Ms. Rudensiuk asked if the Commissions had any questions. There were none. Deputy Chairman Lucietto thanked her for the presentation. OLD BUSINESS None NEW BUSINESS None ADDITIONAL BUSINESS None ADJOURNMENT A motion was made by Mr. Kubala to adjourn the meeting; seconded by Mr. Schillinger. The motion was approved by a viva voce vote. The meeting adjourned at 8:45 p.m. Minutes respectfully submitted by Jackie Milschewski, City Clerk PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING May 12, 2004 PLEASE PRINT NAME: ADDRESS: /?�7. art c� R K�.L C /f, 23 t-Al,; 141 u t� C'G.CUj1 /v/e,c s SIGNIN